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Ukraine thoughts


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2022 Jun 1, 11:18am   6,569 views  98 comments

by Bd6r   ➕follow (2)   💰tip   ignore  

I have been thinking about this for a while again and here are my thoughts, take for what they are worth...

1. Many Patnetters think that because Ukraine is supported by Bidet and the rest of WEF types, it must mean that Ukrainians must be WEF/Bidet supporters. Please remember Afghanistan in 1980's...this is the best analogy. Tell people that help you what they want to hear to get what you want from them. Note gay marriage is illegal in Ukraine etc.
2. One issue that I am struggling with is why Putin attacked Ukraine at time which was most suitable for our ruling class (this took heat away from Bidet and his Euro counterparts from inflation and horribly mismanaged artificial pLandemic). I have few possible explanations and I will list them in order of decreasing probability.
A. Putin is in cahoots with WEF crowd. Ukrainians and Russians suffer in this battle of pawns. He was asked to attack at this particular time.
B. Putin has lost his abilities of cold calculation that he had all these years. Either age or cancer.
C. Coincidence - but those are almost nonexistent.
3. About judging what the hell happens on ground in Ukraine. Dont listen to ghosts of Kiyiv or Zerohedge (which BTW is a CNN of the East aka filial of RT). Look at https://nitter.mstdn.social/oryxspioenkop and see where and what losses are listed for each side. Captured or abandoned equipment means that the other side is advancing in that region. Read also https://nitter.mstdn.social/newkc14 which is Chechen Al Nusra - they dont lie although they favor Ukrainians. News such as "ghost of Kiyiv downed 35 Russian planes" or "Ukrainians desert and surrender en masse" are clickbait for idiots.
4. It is clear that Russian goals (assuming the idea was to defeat Ukraine and not distract Western popular opinion from covid and transfer $$$ to Rayethon) were not achieved. You can see for yourself how did it go for them. From destroying Nazi govt and not letting it join NATO it has morphed to "liberating" a few districts and withdrawing from swaths of central Ukraine with thousands dead. Incidentally, Russia will get a new 1000 mile border with NATO in Finland 150 miles from its biggest city St Petersburg. This is not WINNING!!! and Putin the great has crapped his own pants.
5. It is clear that war in Ukraine is not a US war. Let Europe help Ukraine and sell arms to them. It is also clear that Scholz and his W. European counterparts are typical soy persons, contrary to Poles and the rest of East Europeans (we need to discuss if aggression has to be met by physical force -quote by soyScholtz). Perhaps Poland has to occupy half of Germany. I am sure they could do it rather bloodlessly.
6. Russian atrocities. While we cant believe much if what Ukr or NYT say, Russian track record in Chechnya where they killed a fifth of population means that this is likely happening in Ukraine as well. If/when Ukrainians get into Russia, it will be the same - this is Eastern Europe with specific habits.
7. How will this end. Either this will be a festering conflict for years where one side moves 5 miles here and other side moves 10 miles there, or one of the sides will have an internal collapse/revolution.
8. Opinion of persons who dont speak Russian/ukrainian and are not familiar with the region but feel important enough to analyze situation is quite funny, esp after they show lack of simple knowledge about geography, habits, and populations of the region...
9. I hope Ukrainians win, for 2 major reasons: Russia attacked them twice so they deserve their ass being kicked, and if Ukr win, I suspect NATO in Europe will collapse...this is chatter I hear from E Europe.

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8   Patrick   2022 Jun 1, 12:02pm  

Nuland definitely seemed to have plotted US control of Ukraine. I'd have to go back and look at interviews with her, but you could look them up as well.

And then there are her comments about the biolabs there.
9   Bd6r   2022 Jun 1, 12:04pm  

Patrick says
And then there are her comments about the biolabs there.

There are biolabs in Galveston that contain plague, HIV, etc. Why go to Ukraine? Furthermore, reason why Russia had one of the first ccp flu vacvines - sputnik- is that they have extensive coronavirus labs as well. This is residue from USSR biolabs in both Ukr and Rus. So what?
10   Bd6r   2022 Jun 1, 12:11pm  

About wef leaders:
And then when one digs just a little bit one finds Putin thoroughly on board with Klaus Schwab’s World Economic Forum, whose coterie of wealthy maniacs have been so busy – through the infiltration of governments with their stooges, the manufacturer of economic ruin and social chaos and so forth – trying to “reset” the world into a high-tech feudalism.

One has to ask whether the Russian government is yet another subverted front for the self-appointed, know-best-what-is-good-for-you, aspiring herdsmen of the globalist crime syndicate and its less-than-benign designs for the human race. And whether the Ukraine is yet more manufactured agony staged between governments who, had they been individuals, would have been locked up as craven psychopaths.

The article below (source) gives some insight into the close relationship between Putin and his globalist mentors, as does his speech to the WEF here.

https://www.thelibertybeacon.com/putin-and-the-wef-cause-for-concern-are-we-being-played-yet-again/
11   Ceffer   2022 Jun 1, 12:24pm  

Rumor is two thirds of the arms being sent to Ukraine are being sold on the black market. Once a launderer, always a launderer?
12   Patrick   2022 Jun 1, 12:33pm  

I didn't like Putin bowing and getting a gold chain put on his neck by the Saudi king, just like Trump did. I can't really tell how independent Putin is. Maybe he is indeed just another WEF puppet.

But I am pretty sure that the US government is causing a lot of unnecessary trouble around the world for dubious reasons, and Ukraine seems to fit with that.
13   Ceffer   2022 Jun 1, 12:55pm  

I can't conceive of any scenario that Putin is a WEF puppet. He is a nationalist, and his agenda is so opposed to everything that the WEF/NWO are up to that if they are engaged in some kind of double triple cross reverse agenda, it would appear to be suicidal. WEF: "Hey, Vlad, would you dismantle all of our money laundering and organized crime networks in Ukraine? While you're at it, you can also seize all of those bioweapons labs we so painstakingly, secretly built for the West to poison you. We think this is the best way to further our agendas!"

Woo says the Russians screamed at a secret meeting of Western generals and white hat intels (supposedly some that are under Trump) that they had better take care of the Globalists, or Russia would feel at liberty to intervene to do so. Recent statements out of Russia have been jokingly (or not so jokingly) indicating that Russia is considering de-nazifying Europe, Geneva and the NWO by direct intervention.
14   AmericanKulak   2022 Jun 1, 1:32pm  

Great thoughts here, lots to digest. Thanks OP and commentators.
15   Ceffer   2022 Jun 1, 1:47pm  

Guess the Russkies got some of their inside intel on arms shipments from the West and are bombing Neue-Poland again.
https://t.me/asbmil/1843
16   komputodo   2022 Jun 1, 2:00pm  

Ceffer says

Rumor is two thirds of the arms being sent to Ukraine are being sold on the black market. Once a launderer, always a launderer?

and those weapons will end up in the hands of their mafia types or sold to other ciminals/terrorists
17   HeadSet   2022 Jun 1, 2:01pm  

Ceffer says
Russia is considering de-nazifying Europe

They have done that before.
18   Ceffer   2022 Jun 1, 2:05pm  

komputodo says
and those weapons will end up in the hands of their mafia types or sold to other ciminals/terrorists

Oh, that's just the price of getting your kickbacks. Proxy harm is no biggie.
19   Ceffer   2022 Jun 1, 2:41pm  

Seems ASB Military News has a sense of humor of a sort, Kharkiv next on the Russian menu?:
https://t.me/asbmil/1860

https://t.me/asbmil/1850
20   EBGuy   2022 Jun 1, 3:00pm  

Rising continues the cover the crisis (though, I imagine there is a slant).
Biden Sends MORE Weapons To Ukraine, MSM Narrative CRUMBLES As War Prolongs
Retired Lt. Col. Daniel Davis claims you'd have to train more troops to mount any sort of Ukrainian counter offensive (which would take over a year), so you're probably better off with some sort of negotiated peace.

There are also some documentaries on Kanopy (Frontline I think) that have a perspective from a couple of years back where you can see the civil war unfolding. They refer to a group known as Right Sector operating in Kharkiv (wondering if that was Azov).
21   richwicks   2022 Jun 1, 3:29pm  

EBGuy says
Retired Lt. Col. Daniel Davis claims you'd have to train more troops to mount any sort of Ukrainian counter offensive (which would take over a year), so you're probably better off with some sort of negotiated peace.


What sort of negotiated peace? Something like NATO stays out of Ukraine and stops bombing the Donbass region?

This war was created just to launder money.
22   GNL   2022 Jun 1, 3:43pm  

Bd6r says
if Ukr win, I suspect NATO in Europe will collapse...this is chatter I hear from E Europe.

Why would NATO collapse if they win?
23   RWSGFY   2022 Jun 1, 4:08pm  

Shaman says

How about the French NATO general’s article where he says that Ukraine was the aggressor?


Is he throwing his hat into "King of Idiots" contest?
24   mell   2022 Jun 1, 4:41pm  

Bd6r says
You misunderstood me - US should have no interest in this war wbich is what I meant by not our war.


You have to be kidding. The "leaders" are bankrupting the US by sending hundreds of billions they don't have. "No interest" looks very different
25   EBGuy   2022 Jun 1, 4:57pm  

Looks like the Russians are targetting the $40 billion care package from the US...

#Ukraine confirms Russian cruise missile strike on the #Beskydy railway tunnel. The tunnel, financed by the #EBRD and European Investment Bank, was opened by #Poroshenko in May 2018, and is now believed to be a key supply route for #NATO weapons into the #Donbass. #Russia #Biden pic.twitter.com/naAU6xLZVK— Manchester Chronicle 🐝 (@WithyGrove) June 1, 2022



For some context of how terrifyingly close this is to NATOland


26   Ceffer   2022 Jun 1, 5:29pm  

EBGuy says
For some context of how terrifyingly close this is to NATOland

Soon to be Neue-Poland.
27   BayArea   2022 Jun 1, 10:46pm  

I support the next thing!
28   richwicks   2022 Jun 2, 1:16am  

EBGuy says
For some context of how terrifyingly close this is to NATOland


NATO exists for the United States to take on Russia at some point.

NATO exists for Europe because it's free fucking money from the United States.

We're hearing the usual tough talk from idiot puppet leaders in Europe, but they don't have any interest in WWIII, regardless of how much they are bribed by the Federal Reserve. Mutually Assured Destruction is still in effect, and Russia can wipe out all of Europe if not all of the world. Nobody wins in that shit.

Europe would be smart to dump the US for Russia as a strategic ally, just like the US would be smart to dump Europe in favor of Russia as a strategic ally. The problem I think is that the people that control the United States and control Europe don't give a fuck about their nations. Traitors run both.
29   Bd6r   2022 Jun 2, 6:48am  

WineHorror1 says
Why would NATO collapse if they win?

NATO does not win, Ukraine wins. If Ukr can defeat Russia (even with NATO help) why would the rest of E Europe need NATO provided that the ONLY reason theay are in nato is Russia?
30   Bd6r   2022 Jun 2, 6:52am  

Ceffer says
conceive of any scenario that Putin is a WEF puppet. He is a nationalist, and his agenda is so opposed to everything that the WEF/NWO are up to that if they are engaged in some kind of double triple cross reverse agenda, it would appear to be suicidal. WEF: "Hey, Vlad, would you dismantle all of our money laundering and organized crime networks in Ukraine? While you're at it, you can also seize all of those bioweapons labs we so painstakingly, secretly built for the West to poison you. We think this is the best way to further our agendas!"

Sputnik jab made at the same time or even before Western jabs, mass vaccinations in Russia, attack Ukraine at the time best suited for our plutocrats. Look at what they do not what they say.
I am not 100pct sure myself but I am becoming more conspiratorial by the day
31   Bd6r   2022 Jun 2, 7:00am  

Patrick says
Ukraine on Fire":

I looked through this and it is highly biased Rusdian propaganda. First, if you gubbermint is stupid, you have all rights to overthrow it, and if it is violent towards you as Ys gubbermint was (dispersed peacuful student demonstration, conveniently glossed over), you are fully within your rights to be violent against it. Ukrainians simply were not pussies like Americans were after Bidet stole the last election. Second, they say that ussr "liberated" w. Ukraine in 2nd war. This is Rusdian propaganda. Liberators leave but occupiers stay, and in any case if w ukr would consider themselves liberated, they would not wage a 15 yr guerilla war. There are mire examples of rather primitive Russ propaganda in this movie.
32   Bd6r   2022 Jun 2, 7:04am  

Shaman says
Ukraine won’t win. They can’t. They’re losing badly.

As far as I can tell, Russians were kicked out of Kiev and Harkov districts with thousands dead. This does not sound like winning. Also, hoew come Frog gen thinks that Ukraine is aggressor if Russia attacked? This is reminiscent of Hitler attacking USSR and claiming that ussr is aggressor since it was preventive strike.
33   FortWayneAsNancyPelosiHaircut   2022 Jun 2, 8:39am  

I think US will keep on supplying weapons, MIC is making a killing here. They got to make up for 4 years of Trump not doing wars. With Biden, everyone gets to loot America. And as long as it's Ukrainians are dying somewhere, they don't care. They didn't care when Americans were dying, they care about Ukrainians dying in proxy war even less.
34   Bd6r   2022 Jun 2, 9:45am  

FortWayneAsNancyPelosiHaircut says

I think US will keep on supplying weapons, MIC is making a killing here. They got to make up for 4 years of Trump not doing wars. With Biden, everyone gets to loot America. And as long as it's Ukrainians are dying somewhere, they don't care. They didn't care when Americans were dying, they care about Ukrainians dying in proxy war even less.

A bingo right there.
35   Ceffer   2022 Jun 2, 10:59am  

The 'RussiaManBad' chorus seems to be going into abeyance a bit. Russia never claimed it was going to 'conquer' Ukraine, a false statement that is parroted over and over. It was a 'military operation' with distinct limited goals.

The Kiev thing was a military feint, not a 'defeat', since Russia never intended to invade Kiev, but wanted to keep military tied down there while it executed its Donbas strategy. There are fewer and fewer hanging on the to MSM fake news notion that Russia is 'losing'. It's more like everybody is shuffling about trying to figure out what to do after Russia 'wins' and how to justify the unnecessary loss of Ukrainian lives.

In the meanwhile, our horrific and insane politicians continue their short sighted strategies of corrupt practices. I guess that is the wonder of NWO/WEF centralized wisdom of psychopaths issuing the dictations,
36   Onvacation   2022 Jun 2, 11:47am  

Bd6r says
I am becoming more conspiratorial by the day

It did seem to be a world wide effort to get everyone vaccinated and, even more important, on some kind of "vax passport" that restricted everything.

They failed but they keep coming at us.

I think the most crucial questions about Ukraine are "What was Burisma paying Hunter for?" and "What is up with Vice President Biden extorting the Ukrainians by withholding aid if they did not fire that investigator?".
37   Bd6r   2022 Jun 2, 11:56am  

Onvacation says
the most crucial questions about Ukraine are "What was Burisma paying Hunter for?" and "What is up with Vice President Biden extorting the Ukrainians by withholding aid if they did not fire that investigator?".

Those are easy answers -10 pct or more for the Big Guy
No conspiratorial mindset needed to answer, just common sense
38   Bd6r   2022 Jun 2, 12:47pm  

Ceffer says
Russia never claimed it was going to 'conquer' Ukraine, a false statement that is parroted over and over. It was a 'military operation' with distinct limited goals.

Statement is not supported by facts, provided that you can read in Russian.
https://bloknot.ru/obshhestvo/chto-nam-zhdat-9-maya-pervoj-ser-eznoj-pobedy-ili-nachala-bol-shoj-vojny-923735.html
Встреча с земляками в центре Харькова, по всей видимости, откладывается до следующей войны. Текущая же для России, надо полагать, завершится вскоре некими соглашениями. Будут ли они мирными? Не будут. Разве что формально, как Минск-2. Смертельно ли это?

In general, this strongly reminds of Winter War in Finland, where rhetoric "destruction of anti-Soviet government and replacement with a friendly govt" was replaced with some territorial demands.
39   Patrick   2022 Jun 2, 1:18pm  

deepl.com has this translation:

The meeting with the compatriots in the center of Kharkov is apparently postponed until the next war. For Russia, the current one will presumably end soon with some kind of agreement. Will they be peaceful? No, they will not. Only formally, like Minsk-2. Is it fatal?
40   AmericanKulak   2022 Jun 2, 1:24pm  

One annoying thing I see is copycat bullshit.

Russia puts up video of complaining bunch of AFU soldiers from XXth Battalion, then Ukraine puts up video of complaining bunch of XXth Motorized Division soldiers.

It's all bullshit.

I did see the Ukraine fired their Propaganda Chieftess over abuse videos.
41   Ceffer   2022 Jun 2, 7:17pm  

I think things will become fairly moot after Russia obtains Odessa and that thin strip of Russians along the Moldovan-Ukraine border. What is left of Ukraine, whether partitioned further or not with a section going to Poland, without control over any Black Sea port, will be so poor and neutered that they won't have a lot of options. It won't be necessary to 'conquer' Kiev, they will make deals to survive.

Putin recently told the Ukraine military to overthrow El Zel and negotiate the peace. It seems El Zel is living on borrowed time. Hope he has his go bag with several currencies, passports with aliases, and bag of diamonds to cut fuck with. Florida or South America? I vote South America if he makes it.
42   Bd6r   2022 Jun 2, 7:37pm  

Ceffer says

I think things will become fairly moot after Russia obtains Odessa and that thin strip of Russians along the Moldovan-Ukraine border. What is left of Ukraine, whether partitioned further or not with a section going to Poland, without control over any Black Sea port, will be so poor and neutered that they won't have a lot of options. It won't be necessary to 'conquer' Kiev, they will make deals to survive.

Putin recently told the Ukraine military to overthrow El Zel and negotiate the peace. It seems El Zel is living on borrowed time. Hope he has his go bag with several currencies, passports with aliases, and bag of diamonds to cut fuck with. Florida or South America? I vote South America if he makes it.

We heard here that Russia will not attack, that Ukr will be defeated first in days, then weeks, then months. I believe the above prediction will go the way of the rest of Patnet E Europe specialist forecasts.

Poland is deeply invested in this war on side of Ukraine. If they wanted to partition, they would not help. In fact, they help more than prob anyone else as they have no desire to have a long border with schisofrenic Russia
So good luck also with that prediction, we can return to these in a month.
43   Ceffer   2022 Jun 2, 7:51pm  

I really never heard that Russia was necessarily going to have a successful blitz and conquer in short order. Such things are military estimates. I was wrong that they wouldn't invade, but I certainly am no expert, plus subsequent discoveries like all those weapons labs certainly colored the picture. Russia's reaction appears to be a rational reaction to extensive provocation and bad faith on the part of the West.

I just think the most reliable information that can be generally believed points to Russia succeeding in its Donbas and Black Sea strategies. The Zelensky puppet show relegating Ukrainian soldiers to cannon fodder is disgusting, but I don't feel sorry for the hard core Nazis.
44   AmericanKulak   2022 Jun 2, 7:56pm  

Just a heads up, Chrysta Freeland, Trudeau's right hand woman, had a grandfather that edited the Nazi Ukrainian Militia's newspaper.

https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/chrystia-freeland-needs-to-come-clean-about-her-nazi-collaborationist-grandfather
45   Bd6r   2022 Jun 2, 8:04pm  

Ceffer says
I just think the most reliable information that can be generally believed points to Russia succeeding in its Donbas and Black Sea strategies.

From what I understand and hear, they thought that Ukr will collapse in a few days and that people will rise up and destroy Ze govt. They were going to occupy Kiev - if not, what was the point of costly taking the Gostomel airport? Failed and scaled down the plans.
WRT Nazis, Russians have similar numbers of them. You might want to search on internets for leader of Wagner mercenaries group (owned by chef of Putin)
46   richwicks   2022 Jun 2, 8:19pm  

Bd6r says

Ceffer says
I just think the most reliable information that can be generally believed points to Russia succeeding in its Donbas and Black Sea strategies.

From what I understand and hear, they thought that Ukr will collapse in a few days and that people will rise up and destroy Ze govt. They were going to occupy Kiev - if not, what was the point of costly taking the Gostomel airport? Failed and scaled down the plans.
WRT Nazis, Russians have similar numbers of them. You might want to search on internets for leader of Wagner mercenaries group (owned by chef of Putin)


I heard years ago from Michael Rivero that the stated plan of Russia was to fight a war of attrition in Ukraine against the United States, realizing it was a proxy war. This is Vietnam all over again. Apparently the plan isn't to win, it's to continue fighting to exhaust resources of NATO and the United States. Russia may cut off oil supplies to Europe this winter entirely and prevent a planting season in Ukraine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWT5HM_NMlI

Note the date on that, June 20, 2014. That was just after the United States overthrew Ukraine. If you want an embedded video:


original link
47   Ceffer   2022 Jun 2, 10:47pm  

If commentators like Scott Ritter are to be believed, Russia was prepared for a war of attrition, not a blitz. He states Ukraine was extremely fortified and dug in all along the nominal fronts in Donbas, and presented no quick conquest scenarios. Press blitzes may have stated otherwise for whatever purposes, but it took a while for the disinformation fogs to clear up anyway before the ground situation was elucidated.

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