patrick.net

body armor

Beltfed.

Good place to commit suicide by wandering outside the armed perimeters of the resorts (sometimes inside the resorts, too!).

Jamaica would not be on my list of places to visit. I was there a few years ago and it's turned into a third world hell hole.

If it's the Caribbean you want, why not St Johns/Maarten? Much safer and more scenic... There are plenty of other options in that area that are a better choice.

Last time I was in Jamacia, I was accosted by Ganja sellers instantly at the airport departure area. Our bouncy ride on terrible streets ended at our "4 star" hotel. This was a name brand place so we thought we were ok. The place was rusty everywhere, falling apart and poorly maintained. The staff seemed stoned or uncaring most of the time. The "river excursion" we took was very cheesy and I felt unsafe half the time. The only place I felt safe was in the hotel pool compound. There, I got a toe fungus that has never gone away. I will never go back to this wretched third world cesspool.

Go there to see the future world of LA and Frisco without the wait.

In Jamaica, the venereal diseases have venereal diseases.

Just come down to West Palm Beach Florida and save on airfare.

Tip: If you think someone is talking in English, but you don’t understand him=Jamaican; If you think he’s talking an extraterrestrial language, like in Star Wars=Haitian.

Never been there. Probably never will. I have a bad vibe about that place. One of my closest friends went there for the Christmas holidays a few months before he took his life.

bring yer own EtOH...

Shithole.

What's that AIDS anti-viral called??... Yeah, take that
.

In Jamaica, they subsidize you to vacation there to have somebody to rob. The rob return/vacation subsidy percentage index is very important to the economy.

Jamaica is generally considered to be on the lower end of the quality spectrum in that part of the vacation world.

Stay on the beaten path and hang around the resorts.

You are going out of your way to (for the most part) go to someplace that resembles a bad part of town. If you really want to go to the Caribbean, try PR. Less shitholey.

Or just avoid the whole third world shithole experience and go to Poland instead.

Booger says

You are going out of your way to (for the most part) go to someplace that resembles a bad part of town. If you really want to go to the Caribbean, try PR. Less shitholey.

Or just avoid the whole third world shithole experience and go to Poland instead.

Poland is flippin awesome!

Took my wife to France, Italy, Denmark, Poland two years ago. She wants to go back to Poland most of all.

yeah....dont go...just spend a weekend in Oakland

Rwanda anyone :) saw logo on Arsenal Jersey. https://www.visitrwanda.com/arsenal/ .

BTW - English football is played in empty stadium. India-Aussie Test match has decent crowd -
www.youtube.com/embed/c-OU5ssdUfQ

It's been about 20 years, but I still have many fond memories of Jamaica. I was with locals the whole time, and mostly in small towns, so can't really comment on security other than Kingston where I flew in did not entice me to stay. Heard Ocho Rios is nice, but I'm sure you've already heard that. The locals told me the black sand beaches of Negril are great. I stayed in on the North East side of the island, and it's possibly the most beautiful place I've ever been.

NuttBoxer says

I was with locals the whole time, and mostly in small towns, so can't really comment on security other than Kingston where I flew in did not entice me to stay.

I'd be flying into Montego Bay. I've heard the same thing about the smaller local places. I'd be likely doing the resort/tourist route, but I've generally heard good things. Given the nature of these islands, I can't see it being all that different than PR, DR, USVI, BVI, Cayman, etc. Might be beat up from hurricanes in the past, but I've had great times in all these places. Hard to believe that Jamaica would be "that" bad.

My neighbor has been 12 times. His idea of vacation is different than mine, so I'm not asking him. They'd stay at $25/nt motel rooms (nothing wrong with that) and really immerse themselves with the locals. Only had one somewhat sketchy experience. One story he told he was chatting with a local, hopped on the back of his moped/bike and went to a roadside jerk chicken place. Said it was the best food he ever has had.

Not saying you other guys are wrong, but I still think we'll go. Covid dependent. These places have little to no resources and rely on tourism. As a whitey, I think I'll be fine. Do the usual and not look flashy or like a target. Drug dealers and hagglers are easy to deal with. Nutt's comment is more along the lines of what I've heard about the place. I'll be resorting it as well, and I don't do hole in the wall places. So I feel safe.

I don't think Jamaica is as bad as folks here are saying. But if I were to go, I would definitely go with a Jamaican from here, and stay at their family's homestead.

Jamaicans eagerly await long pig from the continent.

Jerk Chicken is AWESOME! On the safety note, I'll take Jamaica right now over PR, which has become quite a drug hub the past few years. Jamaica does have a long history of violent crime, but not against tourists, as they are a staple of the economy. It has to do with the lack of nuclear family that comes from their slavery days.

I'm jealous, have always wanted to go back.

Old friend's wife was a travel agent who sold Sandals Jamaica before switching to Carnival Cruises. STAY in the tourist areas! Get a legit cab! Expect everything to be a hustle or scam out in the wild. It might be a sterile sandbox environment, but it's generally a SAFE one inside the resorts.

My brother went there in the 80s with his high school band. One of his amusing-not-dangerous local interaction anecdotes was being on a beach and this guy was busking some mediocre reggae. When all of the "tourist handler" types were out of earshot, he started riffing on a more direct theme of, "We love the white man, because he brings MONEYYYYY!"

Every Jamaican from the country(rural not not the Country) I have ever met here in America. Say I remind them of Jamaicans back home.
And I do that, without muttering one single word of patwa or feigning a cheesy Jamaican accent. I never say "Yea Mon!".

They all tell me the same thing, when you're ready to go to Jamaica let me know, you can stay at my family farm.

www.youtube.com/embed/DLXN2HxJ3mE

Automan Empire says

Old friend's wife was a travel agent who sold Sandals Jamaica before switching to Carnival Cruises. STAY in the tourist areas! Get a legit cab! Expect everything to be a hustle or scam out in the wild. It might be a sterile sandbox environment, but it's generally a SAFE one inside the resorts.

That's kind of the plan. I'd still like to check some stuff out off resort. I don't know, I've worked in really bad neighborhoods in Chicago. Englewood has a murder rate of 70 per 40k residents. Or 175 per 100k. There are other just as deadly neighborhoods in Chicago.

Jamaica as a country at its peak (murder capital of the world in 2005 as a country) was 58 per 100k. Most of that in the major cities in Jamaica. Can it be dangerous, sure. But now that I've looked at the stats I'm pretty confident it will be safe. Won't bring anything expensive or that I'm not willing to part with if robbed, which is a low probability with what I'd be doing. If I have handled 3x's as deadly areas and not really thought about it, I think Jamaica will fine.

Not ripping anyone specifically, but I'm not certain some of you guys have been in a truly bad neighborhood. Chicago was more deadly than Iraq during a war for perspective. I cannot imagine Jamaica is worse than Iraq or Chicago for a Caribbean nation. They likely just kill each other and not tourist. Petty theft is a problem in any crowded place. We'll be on resort except for maybe a couple excursions so it's not mundane and boring after awhile.

Jamaica: buying a return ticket means you are an incurable optimist.

Hi Wookie Man,

Did you go to Jamaica? How was it?

B.A.C.A.H. says

Hi Wookie Man,

Did you go to Jamaica? How was it?

Unfortunately no. It was supposed to be a spring break trip. We took in my nephew in January and due to circumstances with my SIL and the dad, it was impossible to get his passport in time (still don't....). We're working on guardianship for him as we're totally handcuffed and travel is our hobby. Complicated situation. We had massive deals too, so it sucks. Fortunately free cancellation with covid going on.

We ended up in Pensacola Beach, FL. Had to keep it domestic and I know the area very well. Went with what we knew.

We'll get there eventually. Have neighbors that are college professors and they've been about 20 times. So we had tips, but they're also hippy type and we were more the resort route with maybe some excursions.

Would much rather go to Florida than Jamaica anyway.

WookieMan says

Not ripping anyone specifically, but I'm not certain some of you guys have been in a truly bad neighborhood

I live in Baltimore city, so yes.

zzyzzx says

WookieMan says

Not ripping anyone specifically, but I'm not certain some of you guys have been in a truly bad neighborhood

I live in Baltimore city, so yes.

You're the exception here. Most just drive or commute through them and have no clue what it's like. I've spent hundreds of hours out of the car in the absolute worst neighborhoods in Chicago for crime. I've been in well over a thousand apartments in these places. Tenants with guns all over. Drugs. 12 kids and shit on the floor. Ovens as the heat source. *Note these are not buildings we owned.
zzyzzx says

Would much rather go to Florida than Jamaica anyway.

There's a misperception out there about foreign places. On non-resort property, St. Thomas looks like a shit hole. You see dark people and I'm being honest when people think ghetto or low lives. It's natural for Americans to think that. Reality is the people are super nice and they've also gotten smashed by hurricanes and now covid. So the place is still rough around the edges. St. John is amazing. Now if only the BVI's would stop being cunts.

Jamaica is likely the same, but admittedly speaking out of my ass not having visited. Their overall crime rate is substantially below that of shit neighborhoods in Chicago or other major cities, even though crime is high there. As with any destination don't stick out and be cautious at night, especially women. Stay out of spots that aren't touristy at night.

WookieMan says

On non-resort property, St. Thomas looks like a shit hole.

Again, another reason to go to Florida instead.

zzyzzx says

Again, another reason to go to Florida instead.

Off the coastal areas of FL there are some shit holes for sure is all I'll say. Love the state. Every state has its baggage.

WookieMan says

We took in my nephew in January and due to circumstances with my SIL and the dad, it was impossible to get his passport in time

When I went around 2000, they accepted birth certificates.

NuttBoxer says

WookieMan says

We took in my nephew in January and due to circumstances with my SIL and the dad, it was impossible to get his passport in time

When I went around 2000, they accepted birth certificates.

Not sure if things have changed. Likely need a passport now. US customs getting back in is the big issue. We almost had a major issue last October getting him back to the states from USVI/St. John (STT). A US territory where passport isn't required. We were all questioned for like 20 minutes all because my nephew didn't have a passport.

Not that it matters to me, but he's mixed and looks darkish black and has a different last name. So no way he's our kid unless adopted. My sons had their passports. It was a pain, but I actually don't mind that they gave us grief. We could have been trafficking a kid. They did their job and I have no qualms about the process.

Some of this security stuff is a huge overreach for sure. Some of it is justifiable. We had no ID and my SIL was MIA to get a notarized travel document. Our fault a bit too. But it wouldn't be all that difficult to kidnap a kid from somewhere and take them. It's alarming easy. Probably why Epstein owned an island on a USVI and dumped rocks on the shoreline so there was no public beach access. No passport required. Clever really as sick as what was (is?) going on.