patrick.net

Wow, either Princeton is censoring Patton's letter or their IT department just sucks ass. The link http://www.dailyprincetonian.com/2013/03/29/33188/ did just get me to the letter from a search on their site, but a refresh or load from a new page causes a 404 error.

I'll just copy the letter below.

OPINION: Letter to the Editor: March 29, 2013
Posted on March 29, 2013

By SUSAN A. PATTON
Guest Contributor
Published: Friday, March 29th, 2013

Advice for the young women of Princeton: the daughters I never had

Forget about having it all, or not having it all, leaning in or leaning out — here’s what you really need to know that nobody is telling you.

For years (decades, really) we have been bombarded with advice on professional advancement, breaking through that glass ceiling and achieving work-life balance. We can figure that out — we are Princeton women. If anyone can overcome professional obstacles, it will be our brilliant, resourceful, very well-educated selves.

A few weeks ago, I attended the Women and Leadership conference on campus that featured a conversation between President Shirley Tilghman and Wilson School professor Anne-Marie Slaughter, and I participated in the breakout session afterward that allowed current undergraduate women to speak informally with older and presumably wiser alumnae. I attended the event with my best friend since our freshman year in 1973. You girls glazed over at preliminary comments about our professional accomplishments and the importance of networking. Then the conversation shifted in tone and interest level when one of you asked how have Kendall and I sustained a friendship for 40 years. You asked if we were ever jealous of each other. You asked about the value of our friendship, about our husbands and children. Clearly, you don’t want any more career advice. At your core, you know that there are other things that you need that nobody is addressing. A lifelong friend is one of them. Finding the right man to marry is another.

When I was an undergraduate in the mid-seventies, the 200 pioneer women in my class would talk about navigating the virile plains of Princeton as a precursor to professional success. Never being one to shy away from expressing an unpopular opinion, I said that I wanted to get married and have children. It was seen as heresy.

For most of you, the cornerstone of your future and happiness will be inextricably linked to the man you marry, and you will never again have this concentration of men who are worthy of you.

Here’s what nobody is telling you: Find a husband on campus before you graduate. Yes, I went there.

I am the mother of two sons who are both Princetonians. My older son had the good judgment and great fortune to marry a classmate of his, but he could have married anyone. My younger son is a junior and the universe of women he can marry is limitless. Men regularly marry women who are younger, less intelligent, less educated. It’s amazing how forgiving men can be about a woman’s lack of erudition, if she is exceptionally pretty. Smart women can’t (shouldn’t) marry men who aren’t at least their intellectual equal. As Princeton women, we have almost priced ourselves out of the market. Simply put, there is a very limited population of men who are as smart or smarter than we are. And I say again — you will never again be surrounded by this concentration of men who are worthy of you.

Of course, once you graduate, you will meet men who are your intellectual equal — just not that many of them. And, you could choose to marry a man who has other things to recommend him besides a soaring intellect. But ultimately, it will frustrate you to be with a man who just isn’t as smart as you.

Here is another truth that you know, but nobody is talking about. As freshman women, you have four classes of men to choose from. Every year, you lose the men in the senior class, and you become older than the class of incoming freshman men. So, by the time you are a senior, you basically have only the men in your own class to choose from, and frankly, they now have four classes of women to choose from. Maybe you should have been a little nicer to these guys when you were freshmen?

If I had daughters, this is what I would be telling them.

Susan A. Patton ’77
President of the Class of 1977
New York, N.Y.

Funny, I just drove past princeton, and heard something about this on the radio. I'm not so sure I agree with this womans advice, she is suggesting limiting oneself to an incredibly tiny pool of possible mates.

Heh, Heh, looks like a bit of libber backtracking there.

Freud said he never knew what women wanted. I think the answer is, they want everything all at the same time, to have what men have and women have and whatever they don't have. Because they want everything and all things, they always are doomed to feel that they settled for what they DO have.

Dan, you're falling for the selection bias of commercial news. Of course they look for whatever distraction will keep the viewers in their seats until the next drug ad. In a country of more than 300 million people, you can find literally hundreds of "one in a million" unrepresentative examples that tell you almost nothing about the remaining 99.9999%. You'd have a better chance guessing the median net worth of the Seattle metropolitan area by sampling Bill Gates and Paul Allen, rather than relying on whatever two or three "opposing views" a commercial news producer selected. Even the selection of the story seems intended to produce this effect - had anybody ever heard of Susan Patton before? Did she hire a publicist to raise her profile by writing something that might seem sensible to some people and yet raise a controversy somewhere telegenic, even if only in the pierced and tattooed pink-haired crowd? If she were independently notable like Hillary Clinton or Barbara Bush, this might seem like an actual story, but she isn't, so no.

Dan8267 says

Wow, either Princeton is censoring Patton's letter or their IT department just sucks ass. The link http://www.dailyprincetonian.com/2013/03/29/33188/ did just get me to the letter from a search on their site, but a refresh or load from a new page causes a 404 error.

I'll just copy the letter below.

No censorship. You can't link any url from their website. They are using some sort of cloak url redirecting everything to their home page. It may be an attempt for greater frontpage ranking. FIIK.

curious2 says

Dan, you're falling for the selection bias of commercial news.

Your saying the news reports don't reflect public opinion. Perhaps, but the comments on the Princeton Princetonian website aren't very flattering either. Although much of that is polarized, too. It's like people can't have an honest discussion about some subjects.

rooemoore says

No censorship. You can't link any url from their website. They are using some sort of cloak url redirecting everything to their home page. It may be an attempt for greater frontpage ranking. FIIK.

Yeah, looking at the search page results HTML code, the real URL is http://thedailyprincetonian.wordpress.com/2013/03/29/opinion-letter-to-the-editor-march-29-2013/

However, if click on the search result, it takes you to the content of that page but rewrites the URL to http://www.dailyprincetonian.com/2013/03/29/33188/, which is not mapped by their website to any content. Still sounds like a bug too me, but it may be a bug resulting from an attempt to game the system.

personally I think the vast majority of women in higher ed today shouldn't even be there at all, they should be raising families.

Just look at how women dress these days in college.

The Original Bankster says

personally I think the vast majority of women in higher ed today shouldn't even be there at all, they should be raising families.

Just look at how women dress these days in college.

RACIST

errc says

The Original Bankster says

personally I think the vast majority of women in higher ed today shouldn't even be there at all, they should be raising families.

Just look at how women dress these days in college.

RACIST

Feminism is welfare for middle class white women.

Susan is entitled to her opinion. And I'm pretty sure many folks who become couples do meet in college anyway.

But I believe that going to college "to meet someone" is not a good reason to go there. Education should still be a priority. Most college kids are way too immature for life changing events like marriage. Many still drink and party all day long, and vote liberal, with no concept of responsibility or work ethic.

errc says

The Original Bankster says

personally I think the vast majority of women in higher ed today shouldn't even be there at all, they should be raising families.

Just look at how women dress these days in college.

RACIST

To be fair, my wife agrees with the bankster on that one.

FortWayne says

Susan is entitled to her opinion. And I'm pretty sure many folks who become couples do meet in college anyway.

But I believe that going to college "to meet someone" is not a good reason to go there. Education should still be a priority. Most college kids are way too immature for life changing events like marriage. Many still drink and party all day long, and vote liberal, with no concept of responsibility or work ethic.

well she is speaking on behalf of Princeton.

Im sure in the back of her mind shes thinking: why do women have to go to college at all?

given what she says here, most importantly suggesting that family is a priority, then higher ed is simply not practical for 95% of women. It works if you can foot the $200k bill via mommy and daddy. If you can't commit to a serious career - and women shouldn't - the higher ed is not for you.

no doubt the education industry played an important role in all this. they fooled women into thinking this education product was a good idea for them, they turned them all into emotional basket cases who ARE IN DEBT FOR LIFE.

FortWayne says

errc says

The Original Bankster says

personally I think the vast majority of women in higher ed today shouldn't even be there at all, they should be raising families.

Just look at how women dress these days in college.

RACIST

To be fair, my wife agrees with the bankster on that one.

go to university of arizona, Im no prudish sermonizer and I would even say that these women look like f-ing prostitutes.

Her husband sure dodged a bullet on that one.
She's entitled to her opinion, perhaps she's going long on batteries.

And here I'm telling the young guys, "Gitcher self a low class Latin American Girl".

Of course "low class" has a different connotation in Latin Ameirca than in the US.
Simply meaning a girl from humble means, that is not Americanized, or NOT from the privileged class in South Ameirca(who by the way believe they are the biggest humanitarians on earth. As tarp draped shanties dot the sand hills, that surround all of their expensive lush cities.)

Here in the states a Low class girl would be a Jerry Springer regular.

Well then, absent the hordes of whores at these universities, why would males partake in such a silly venture? Cmon now, next you'll be saying tptb duped womyn into thinking they won some battle by obtaining the privilege to join the workforce. Lol

south american girls are nice.

so are slavic/russian girls if you prefer a lighter skinned physical type.

they've got everything American women have, and are interested in having a family.

American women are the worst. Does anyone come to America to meet women? never.

errc says

Well then, absent the hordes of whores at these universities, why would males partake in such a silly venture? Cmon now, next you'll be saying tptb duped womyn into thinking they won some battle by obtaining the privilege to join the workforce. Lol

I've already said that elsewhere.

women dont really want to work. they simply want the prestige of being in these jobs. Watch them in the workplace. What they DO want to do, is look feminine, attract men, and manipulate people socially.

Women are the primary reason why workplace standards have degraded significantly.

They don't belong in the workplace. The workplace is a place where men compete for success. Try putting women and men in separate departments. Here is what will happen: 1) most of the women will quit because they dont get anything from the arrangement ie. can't suck off the system 2) the male department will start producing at a much faster rate.

Just imagine, if you married someone at 20 and divorced at 30, the court now has jurisdiction over you for life in CA. Freedom!!

CaptainShuddup says

Of course "low class" has a different connotation in Latin Ameirca than in the US.

Simply meaning a girl from humble means, that is not Americanized, or NOT from the privileged class in South Ameirca(who by the way believe they are the biggest humanitarians on earth. As tarp draped shanties dot the sand hills, that surround all of their expensive lush cities.)

Wow, Captain, every word here is a Gem.

there was one feminist woman who decided to build a company FOR women OF women. As in, she only hired women thinking she could do away with the inequality.

it was a complete disaster. The founder of the company later stated she would never hire a woman ever again.

The Original Bankster says

American women are the worst. Does anyone come to America to meet women?
never.

Nope, just men only to divorce them later and do it all over again. There's not many faster ways to improve their standard of living that fast, or as easily.

upisdown says

Nope, just men only to divorce them later and do it all over again. There's not many faster ways to improve their standard of living that fast, or as easily.

there might be some from the third world doing this, but there are also many many success stories.

men run the very same risks of financial ruin with another American as they would with a Russian or Peruvian. Same shit from a man's perspective.

The Original Bankster says

men run the very same risks of financial ruin with another American as they
would with a Russian or Peruvian. Same shit from a man's perspective.

LOL, if the woman ends up with all your asstes including those in the future, does it really matter what country they are from? I guess that probably added some price increase to that life-like doll people were bidding on to spend a day with.

FortWayne says

Most college kids are way too immature for life changing events like marriage. Many still drink and party all day long, and vote liberal, with no concept of responsibility or work ethic.

Oh, how our words say more about us than who we are talking about...

FortWayne says

errc says

The Original Bankster says

personally I think the vast majority of women in higher ed today shouldn't even be there at all, they should be raising families.

Just look at how women dress these days in college.

RACIST

To be fair, my wife agrees with the bankster on that one.

You should see how the women who do not attend college dress.

The Original Bankster says

well she is speaking on behalf of Princeton.

I wouldn't say that. She wrote an open letter to the Princetonian (a Princeton Newspaper) in which she offers advice to Princeton women based on her own life experience. No user comments in any newspaper reflect the opinions of those running the Newspaper. That's why all newspapers, including the Princetonian, say

Editor’s Note: All posts whose headlines begin with the word “OPINION” — including this Letter to the Editor — reflect the views of the individual author and do not necessarily represent the view of The Daily Princetonian or its staff.

The Original Bankster says

Im sure in the back of her mind shes thinking: why do women have to go to college at all?

I can guarantee you that is not what she is thinking.

The fact is that both men and women spend a large amount of time seeking romantic and/or sexual relationships during college. They do this while also studying and learning (or not). The fact is that a person is going to spend X% of his or her time socializing and a good portion of that time in romantic and/or sexual relationships. The only difference is whether those relationships are short-term or long-term. Either way, that person is going to spend as much time on relationships and not studying. So it's not a choice between work hard to find romance; it's a choice between find a long-term partner or a fuck buddy.

Patton is thinking and saying that instead of looking for the next fuck buddy, women should be looking for the man they want to spend the rest of their lives with. This intent is clear from the video.

Now, whether or not you agree with the opinion is another matter. Surely, it's in my own personal interest that college women are only looking for fuck buddies. But that does not necessarily mean it is in their interests.

In any case, the subject matter is worthy of discussion regardless of the intent of the person who brought it up. Where an idea comes from is irrelevant to its merit. See Dark Star.

Dan8267 says

FortWayne says

errc says

The Original Bankster says

personally I think the vast majority of women in higher ed today shouldn't even be there at all, they should be raising families.

Just look at how women dress these days in college.

RACIST

To be fair, my wife agrees with the bankster on that one.

You should see how the women who do not attend college dress.

the difference is not in education level but in socioeconomic status.

The Original Bankster says

there was one feminist woman who decided to build a company FOR women OF women. As in, she only hired women thinking she could do away with the inequality.

it was a complete disaster. The founder of the company later stated she would never hire a woman ever again.

Do you have more details on this.
It's like that putz that divorced his parents in the 80s, she died a few months back. And now he says, he was too young to understand the hardships of being a parent, and that some Liberal meddler, who hates families egged him on, to do it. Now is biggest regret his that he didn't make peace(seek forgiveness) with his biological Mom before she died.

Dan8267 says

FortWayne says

errc says

The Original Bankster says

personally I think the vast majority of women in higher ed today shouldn't even be there at all, they should be raising families.

Just look at how women dress these days in college.

RACIST

To be fair, my wife agrees with the bankster on that one.

You should see how the women who do not attend college dress.

If they say they are doing it to get themselves through college, who am I to judge?

Dan8267 says

FortWayne says

errc says

The Original Bankster says

personally I think the vast majority of women in higher ed today shouldn't even be there at all, they should be raising families.

Just look at how women dress these days in college.

RACIST

To be fair, my wife agrees with the bankster on that one.

You should see how the women who do not attend college dress.

I prefer to see them naked

I agree with the author that you are exposed to the highest number of quality mates while in college. This is especially true if you're a man going engineering or tech. However, it depends on the individual's maturity level as to whether they are ready for identifying their wife/husband.

Aside from that she is pretty insufferable. That you went to Princeton doesn't mean you are the smartest person on the planet. It means you came from money and got good grades in high school. Get over yourself and your bratty kids.

The Original Bankster says

south american girls are nice.

so are slavic/russian girls if you prefer a lighter skinned physical type.

Where can I find a big-dicked man?

LOL - I avoided commenting on this thread because it seemed such a silly non-story, but the fact is the advice is merely inapplicable to most undergraduates. I love how she uses the phrase, "Yes, I went there." Ooh, she's sassy, circa 10 years ago. If her advice were so good, why would she limit it to the women? And why is she telling the young lesbians to find a husband? Does she think nobody else ever told them that before? Young women and men have their own plans for their futures, and for their own reasons. If you've been studying Chinese because you want to live and work in Hong Kong, and you are offered a job there, would you really want to be married to somebody whose only job offers turn out to be in New York? Undergraduates would be better advised to build their social networks, meet more people, make more friends (whether sexual or not), so that wherever they go after graduation they have a good chance of knowing people who can help them make their way.

But it would make a novel pick-up line. "Hi, I'm a radical dyke and after graduation I want to ride my Harley to Alaska and build a cabin, but right now we're both in New Jersey because our parents sent us to Princeton, will you be my husband?" I'll bet he hasn't heard that one before.

finehoe says

south american girls are nice.

so are slavic/russian girls if you prefer a lighter skinned physical type.

Where can I find a big-dicked man?

Africa.

@Patrick, can you just nuke KarlRoveIsScum. I'm getting tired of deleting troll posts like this one. I can tolerate moderate trolling, but there comes a point when a troll is just disrupting all conversations.

KarlRoveIsScum says

Go fuck yourself Dan

Tea Party Lunatic.

KarlRoveIsScum says

racist fuck, go fuck yourself you asshole.

KarlRoveIsScum says

Tea Party lunatic go fuck yourself Dan

Read your own pathetic Tea Party posts all 7000+ of them

Fucking shit head.

errc says

I prefer to see them naked

You will some day!

finehoe says

Where can I find a big-dicked man?

We are often taken off the market early.

I put Karl on ignore long ago. That boy has some anger issues, and no discipline at all.