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Landru3000 says

Troy says

KY also receives ~$1.50 for every $1 it sends to DC.

And this figure is from where?

At least as of a 2007 study, Kentucky rolled in $1.51 for every $1 they paid, from 2005 data. It's interesting how Kentucky rose quite steadily over the decades, from $1.06 in 1981. Sort of like that mythical "welfare queen" it's like they get on the dole and just spiral down becoming ever more dependent.

http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/22685.html

Unexpectedly to me, Alaska doesn't come in first in the "gimme" game, they are at #3 behind New Mexico and Mississippi. It's incredibly hypocritical that they decry Federal spending, while at the same time benefitting from it. I am reminded again that Rand Paul was all for MediCare cuts, until he took a close look at how that would cut his salary as a doctor. Of course it's only "waste" if someone ELSE is getting their trough filled. I expect if you seriously moved to ACTING fiscally conservative and have your constituents suck it up and LIVE it, like cutting back to a mere parity of $1 for $1 in these states you'd be run out of town on a rail.

A simple table derived from the full report:

@Vicente

Thanks for the chart. I have already sent it off to many friends. I had a US map along similar lines but yours is even more detailed!

What is interesting as as well is when many of the people from Red States complain and drag their feet at the mention of any aid to California-a net contributer to the Federal pot over the years. I am not necessarily advocating a bailout of California, but just saying it wouldn't be as unfair as many (Red State people) think.

Zlxr says

Furthermore, by subsidizing rent - people are drawn to come here from other States (or countries). Why should we have 30% or so of the people who need aid? Why isn’t this balanced out between all the States?

http://www.novoco.com/low_income_housing/resource_files/research_center/housingcareport.pdf

Interesting read - although severely outdated given the current economic times in which we live. But z, I have a hard time believing that 30% of the people in the US who receive housing assistance live in California - care to share a link?

The supposition of this thread is that the housing market would adjust if people were to be bumped off of subsidized housing and had to live on their income - especially the low incomes of janitors and housekeepers. We have scads of empty houses where they could live - but that ain't happening either.

No easy solutions.

elliemae says

We have scads of empty houses where they could live - but that ain’t happening either.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/41355854
(nearly 11% of us houses are empty)

APOCALYPSEFUCK says

If they can’t pay their way, offer them to the Chinese to pay off the national debt.

Alaska, bought from the Russians for $5M, sold to the Chinese for $5T.

I like it!

I cannot tell which posts above are sincere and which are sarcasm or jokes.

California residents deduct state income tax before sending any money to D.C. The state keeps it instead of DC sending it back.

From the Shasta County Newspaper - Redding Record Searchlight. For those out of state, Shasta County (population 179K or so) is in the North State, and is home to the last large City (Redding pop. 91K or so) before Oregon on I-5. Some insight into how the voucher program works.

http://www.redding.com/news/2011/feb/05/section-8-housing-145not-getting-turnover-face/

TheRammer says

I cannot tell which posts above are sincere and which are sarcasm or jokes.
California residents deduct state income tax before sending any money to D.C. The state keeps it instead of DC sending it back.

Sure, but the feds send more money to all the states. I believe that's the $ everyone is concerned about.

I don't believe that ending public housing programs would be in the best interests of the poor, who are barely getting by. To those people who say that it's their fault, I'd point out the multitudes of people who are out of work now and have been for a few years. They've blown thru their retirements and all their savings, this is why public housing exists. However, in order to be eligibile for PHA programs (and S8), they have to qualify for the programs at the time of application and continue to qualify until they're accepted.

In other words, if they had savings and income at the time of the application, they're not eligible. They're only eligible if they're broke, homeless and stay that way until they are awarded housing. The system blows and it needs an overhaul - but not to be ended.

I much rather they increase capital gains tax to match income tax. This way we'll have more jobs because money would be redirected from gambling over to commerce and business (aka jobs).

ChrisLA says

I much rather they increase capital gains tax to match income tax.

I'd much rather we tax the shit out of rents.

40% of the west coast rents, maybe 50 million households nation wide, each at $500/mo would be $300 billion dollars of free money for the government. This would turn the evil of Prop 13 into a wonderful boon, too : )

Pretty sad day tho when $300B in additional revenue doesn't even come close to closing the deficit.

I do think that Section 8 tends to drive people to strange behavior. I used to work with a sweet young woman who had a section 8 voucher for the home she shared with her little girl and her boyfriend. She had to pretend the boyfriend (her daughter's dad) didn't exist, or else his income would come into play and they would lose the voucher. She was also fairly motivated not to get a raise, not to get a better job, because again she could lose her benefits, and an incremental increase in income would not make up for the loss. She had great family support (grandma handled daycare for free), and she took her daughter out to dinner just about every night. I think that she could have perhaps managed market-rate rent. But she knew what she needed to do and say in order to keep the voucher.

I am sure that someone else on the waiting list could have used the voucher. But she got quite accustomed to having it. And she was not a bad person, not at all, but the game is set up in a way that invites people to play.

Eliza says

I do think that Section 8 tends to drive people to strange behavior

Sure - but so do other rental situations. I know people who sneak family members in to live because the LL limits the amount of occupants. But there's more to your story than meets the eye... rent is figured on adjusted gross income less a utility credit. There are people in PH and S8 who receive refunds every month rather than paying rent.

Reforms are needed - that's for sure. But they help to house people that otherwise wouldn't have a place to live.

Public housing (including Section 8) makes up 4.5% of the US housing stock. Given that 30-40% of the population is underhoused--either too crowded, too expensive or in poor condition, or a combination of all these--it's not as though those who need assistance are getting it. Most people on welfare--TANF, SSI etc.--get no housing assistance. I think the best proposal would, in fact, be to take the $80 billion housing subsidy known as the mortgage interest deduction and solve our affordable housing problem, either by building new housing or buying up existing housing (there seems to be a lot around these days).

And public housing was intended to be foul. Real estate interests insisted that any public housing be set apart from other housing, not be attractive either to residents or the community, and be stigmatizing for the residents. Don't blame either the government or the residents; blame the NAR.

It is so strange that the fruit fell so far away from the tree.

My wife qualified for Section 8 as a single mother. Five years later we are quitting the program for a $500/month rental in Playas de Tijuana. Section 8 gave us a bigger place then we could have afforded on our own, but never enabled us to build any real savings. After we move to Tijuana we will be able to build long and short term savings accounts for purchases such as a home(in a couple years when they're much cheaper), and yearly things like more vacations.

Section 8, and other programs my wife used to be on(food stamps, Medical, TANF, etc) do just enough to help you get by, but never enough to help you get free.

Slave to Big Brother, or freedom in our sister city...? I'll take the latter.

nice graph and good commentary Vincente.

I live in one of those Red states, and out here, its definitely the three G's. And you have a variety of Right wingers who will darn near run you over when farmer welfare money is being handed out. Amazes me how much people hate the "gubbermint" and want it out of there lives till it comes knocking at there door for the cut off.

ragingpinko says

And public housing was intended to be foul. Real estate interests insisted that any public housing be set apart from other housing, not be attractive either to residents or the community, and be stigmatizing for the residents. Don’t blame either the government or the residents; blame the NAR.

source, please.