patrick.net

RayAmerica says

Uh, I don’t mean any disrespect, but isn’t that kind of what the adult life is all about? That is, people attempting to seperate you from your money, etc.?

Not if you have any dignity, no. But to a realtor, such a concept means absolutely nothing.

bubblesitter says

I think you are an asshole. What is the subject/title of this thread? What are other guys on this thread saying about Realtors? If you don’t have anything negative for Realtors than you are wasting you time on this thread.

Oh-is that how it works? You have to agree with the OP or else you shouldn't post? Sorry--didn't get the memo.

But you are right about one thing--I am an asshole

tatupu70 says

bubblesitter says

I think you are an asshole. What is the subject/title of this thread? What are other guys on this thread saying about Realtors? If you don’t have anything negative for Realtors than you are wasting you time on this thread.

Oh-is that how it works? You have to agree with the OP or else you shouldn’t post? Sorry–didn’t get the memo.
But you are right about one thing–I am an asshole

Oh I get it. You are one of the Realtor fans and I am on a different boat. You have the right to be on a different boat.

Me and my wife went to an open house this weekend.

We currently live in an apartment complex. We are both Hispanic
and we first went into the house the two Realtors just ignored us
and barely even greeted us and didn't show us the house. We did
out own tour of the house.

Later I started chit chatting with one of the agents and informed I
was an engineer at the biggest corporation in town(Fortune 100).
My o my how her eyes widened, she started talking so fast, telling
me to put in my bid now, and that the house would be cheaper than
my 495 dollar rent to which I replied , that's impossible as Taxes and
Insurance will be half of that month. To which she answered as long
it's close to your rent maybe 900 a month.

She also said when looking at Real Estate never look at total price and
only consider the monthly payment. LOL

Scumbags and racists ones at that !

One thing was true though. Most people really do borrow as much as possible, whenever they can.

The things that frustrates me the most, even is a buyers market is you can't compete with stupid.

robertoaribas says

ot my license at first primarily for my own investments. But quickly I found out how non English speakers were getting absolutely robbed by loan officers and Realtors, people who they knew could not file complaints, because of fear of getting deported.

This is still happening, and not all realtors are bad but a large majority of them are.
You seem like a good agent, I've met a few before, but Real Estate was their second job
so they could afford not to rip off clients. However, if Real Estate is your primary job
you almost have to cheat, lie, steal to survive.

Hispanics and Pacific Islanders are still getting scammed even today, it's a sad sight to see. During the boom in my area special neighborhoods were built for them from scratch, I'm sure the houses looked good at the time, but 6-7 years later the houses are falling apart. The must have used the cheapest materials available. A six year old house falling apart.

My mother was a loan officer for all of the '80s and most of the '90s, and she and her coworkers always referred to real estate agents as whores and roustabouts. We would drive around town and she would point at their Glamour Shot photos on bus stop benches and tell me stories about their sordid lives and reputations. Stories of alcholism, alimony leeching, petty grifting, legal botching on contracts . . . to a young child's imagination, these stories painted quite a swashbuckling picture of the real estate "profession."

One agent that had a quite a reputation among the local mortgage bankers ended up squatting in one of her own listings for a few months, which just happened to be three streets away from us in our own neighborhood. Her boyfriend was a pill dealer, and her teenage daughter quickly got pregnant from some kid that lived across the street. The house apparently had to be gutted after their brief tenancy. Right before this lady was "removed" from the property, she got in a tiff with my mother because the underwriter killed a loan on one of her contracts. She drove right into our yard in her massive '70s black Lincoln Town Car (back when they had those weird little oval windows behind the rear doors), pulled up as close to the front door as she could get, and came yelling at our door, smoking a cigarette, with a cheap black dye job and grey roots showing. She was Cruella DeVille.

Nowadays, I suppose real estate agents drive a Lexus and get boob jobs instead of dye jobs. They still do those bus bench Glamour Shots, though.

Philistine says

My mother was a loan officer for all of the ’80s and most of the ’90s, and she and her coworkers always referred to real estate agents as whores and roustabouts.

That isn't very nice. Whores and roustabouts perform actual, useful functions/services in society.

I'm sure your mother is a wonderful person, but I'm not sure a loan officer should be doing any talking. The whole glass house thing...

tatupu70 says

I’m sure your mother is a wonderful person, but I’m not sure a loan officer should be doing any talking

Absolutely. It got to a point in the early '90s where my mother's office was asking her to put her headshot on business cards, and boob jobs were the only way of competing with the boys' club, so she got out of the racket.

tatupu70 says

The whole glass house thing…

Or the whole pot/black kettle thing. Fill in your own cliche here. . . .

Loan officers did an enormous amount of damage to the housing market. Loan officers were telling everyone that had the ears to hear that home equity was "sleeping" and not making any money. They advised taking the equity money out (cash out refi) and investing it in mutual funds, etc. A lot of that money was also used to buy depreciating junk such as cars, boats, motorcycles, etc. ... most of which will be in the junk yard while they continue to pay for it 30 years later. Many (if not most) of these same people now have mortgages that are higher than their cash out refinanced home is worth. Literally trillions of dollars were removed from the equity position of homeowners, which in turn fueled the bulk of Bush's economy.

Also, loan officers are paid commissions based on the amount of the loan, so there was a huge incentive to talk homeowners into removing as much equity as possible in order to increase the refinanced mortgage amount.

Armando148 says

This is still happening, and not all realtors are bad but a large majority of them are.

What statistical proof do you have to prove your statement?

It's amazing that you people spend so much time whining about Realtors when the bulk of the "evil" they are supposed to do to you can only be done if YOU let them. On the other hand, politicians do enormous harm to this country and YOU literally every single day, and yet there is barely a whimper. There is something very strange about that.

There's plenty of blame to go around, and there's not much that can be done to stem the tide of corruption, greed, and other unscrupulous behavior. You can just act, react and adapt. You can yell at a tree for growing right into your house, but it won't do much to stop it from growing into it.

EastCoastBubbleBoy says

The things that frustrates me the most, even is a buyers market is you can’t compete with stupid.

LoL - quote of the year.

RayAmerica says

Armando148 says

This is still happening, and not all realtors are bad but a large majority of them are.

What statistical proof do you have to prove your statement?

I don't know what would satisfy you as ironclad proof, but the fact that everybody that is't a realtor believes it should be good enough. Go ahead and search google for the most and least respected professions. Guess which list realtors end up on.

RayAmerica says

It’s amazing that you people spend so much time whining about Realtors when the bulk of the “evil” they are supposed to do to you can only be done if YOU let them. On the other hand, politicians do enormous harm to this country and YOU literally every single day, and yet there is barely a whimper. There is something very strange about that.

So can you tell us the proportion of complaints made against politicians versus the proportion of complaints made against realtors of the general populace and of the responders of this forum? Furthermore, this is a forum about real estate, so it is natural that the here will complain about realtors a great deal.

Please, it's REALTORS®; these folks are professionals. It's not like they caused home prices to become unaffordable; in fact, they helped make them more affordable.

klarek says

I don’t know what would satisfy you as ironclad proof, but the fact that everybody that is’t a realtor believes it should be good enough

Like when everyone thought housing only went up?

On an annual basis, how many people lose their lives due to real estate agents?

ZERO

On an annual basis, how many people in the USA lose their lives due to medical malpractice?

195,000

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/11856.php

The housing bubble required several players outside of realtors, appraisers, underwriters, Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, Barney Frank, Christ Dodd, Bill Clinton, George Bush, Alan Greenspan, Ben Bernanke, etc. All of these people and entities benefitted in a variety of ways as housing continued to escalate, including the following:

Sellers .... that wanted to sell for the highest price possible.

Buyers .... that wanted to buy real estate under the false hope that it was a sure way to become rich, the easy way.

Greed is not a phenomenon that belongs solely to real estate agents.

Or as I like to say, EVERYONE in the securitization stream is culpable, from the home buyer all the way through to the buyer the MBS. Any one player could have pulled the plug -- but no one did.

EastCoastBubbleBoy says

One thing was true though. Most people really do borrow as much as possible, whenever they can.

The things that frustrates me the most, even is a buyers market is you can’t compete with stupid.

Amen to that.

and the finance houses that underwrote the securities
How far to you want to set the wayback machine, Sherman? These guys stopped giving a $@#! once they became publicly traded companies -- after all, its just the shareholders who have something to lose. About the only soft spot I have in the blame game is the the influence peddling in the Magnetar Trade that went on before the bubble popped. Material disclosure? Who could have known? I think this put the accelerator to the floor and allowed the house of cards to go a couple of years beyond it's natural end point.

BobbyS says

Furthermore, this is a forum about real estate, so it is natural that the here will complain about realtors a great deal.

If in a random business blog the topic of "what occupations in general do you despise or think are criminal," realtors would be right up there with stock traders and pickpockets. But yes, it's only natural that in a housing forum we all hate those parasites.

RayAmerica says

On an annual basis, how many people lose their lives due to real estate agents?

ZERO

How many of my friends and coworkers bought the advice of their realtors and suffered a financial loss greater than you could imagine: MOST. Their lives are fucked. realtors do kill people too. But since you set the bar that low, I don't know where you plan to go from there.

RayAmerica says

Greed is not a phenomenon that belongs solely to real estate agents.

Correct. But they are the poster child for it in mainstream America. Greedy, overpaid, liars, fuck their clients, etc.

klarek says

How many of my friends and coworkers bought the advice of their realtors and suffered a financial loss greater than you could imagine: MOST. Their lives are fucked. realtors do kill people too. But since you set the bar that low, I don’t know where you plan to go from there.

That is beyond idiotic. A realtor's job is to sell houses. They are knowledgeable about the local area and the housing market. They are not economists and aren't well versed in how to spot a bubble.

It is not a good idea to trust that salespeople are looking out for your interests. Just like it is not a good idea to send checks to African Royalty that emailed you....

Nomograph says

I agree with Ray 100%. Alert the media.

I called CBS News to report it. Amazingly, they already knew about it.

tatupu70 says

That is beyond idiotic. A realtor’s job is to sell houses. They are knowledgeable about the local area and the housing market. They are not economists and aren’t well versed in how to spot a bubble.
It is not a good idea to trust that salespeople are looking out for your interests. Just like it is not a good idea to send checks to African Royalty that emailed you….

Another story worthy of media attention. I agree 100%.

tatupu70 says

That is beyond idiotic. A realtor’s job is to sell houses. They are knowledgeable about the local area and the housing market.

To an uninformed buyer (which I think represents 99% of first time buyers and 75% of move-ups), the realtor is the king of market information. Yes, their job is to sell. I mean, open doors. Whatever.

Every friend I tried to talk into stepping off of the ledge said something to the effect of "my realtor said I'd be priced out if I didn't buy now, and they are the experts".

Naive and trustworthy people get fucked every day by those scumbags. By being in the industry, they are given the benefit of doubt by most of their clients. How is it that you can't see how morally objectionable this bullshit is?

RayAmerica says

Another story worthy of media attention. I agree 100%.

So how many of your past clients are underwater? In foreclosure or already gone through the process? Better yet, how many of your buyers from 2003-2008 would you have the courage to speak to, face-to-face? Of course, you're not responsible, and I'm sure you didn't peddle the "buy now before you're priced out forever" line.

So, how many?

klarek says

Every friend I tried to talk into stepping off of the ledge said something to the effect of “my realtor said I’d be priced out if I didn’t buy now, and they are the experts”.

You might need to get some new friends. Seriously--do you think someone who's job it is to sell houses is going to tell you not to buy? Not to mention that probably 95% of the experts also were saying the same things. In what world do you think it's possible that a realtor would tell a client that they shouldn't buy??

Again--they are experts in the housing market. Not macro-economics. They know which areas have Cape Cods or ranch style houses. And what comparables sell for. Trusting them to tell you if the house will increase in value is like asking your broker how his stock picks will perform.

RayAmerica says

This thread illustrates very well that there are a lot of insecure people here. This obsession with real estate agents is comical.

Might it have something to do with the fact that this is a RE discussion site?

Nomograph says

BTW, didn’t you say you are studying to be a RE agent?

Yes, getting my license. No, will not be a full time agent. I have a normal, non-scumbag job. Just doing this to keep friends and relatives' money in their own hands and out of the claws of realtors.

tatupu70 says

Seriously–do you think someone who’s job it is to sell houses is going to tell you not to buy?

As far as most first time buyers are concerned, they are the authority on real estate. It's not that they'd say it's a bad time to buy, it's that within their exclusive access to their clients they can come up with a number of provided reasons (propaganda) issued by NAR. I don't blame my friends just because they were naive. Their intentions were not evil like realtors' intentions are.

klarek says

Their intentions were not evil like realtors’ intentions are

Evil? Give me a break. If you want to blame them for your friends ignorance, you're welcome to it. When they buy a 6% load on their mutual fund, it will be the finance guy's fault. When they buy the rustproofing on their new car, it's the car salesman's fault. When they get the 5 year warranty on their new TV, it's the Best Buy checkout kid's fault.

It's funny--I thought I remembered you advocating personal responsibility on a different thread. What happened to that train of thought?

tatupu70 says

It’s funny–I thought I remembered you advocating personal responsibility on a different thread. What happened to that train of thought?

Correct, and my friends are paying for their mistakes. There is nothing inconsistent with what I'm saying here and then, nor does it take away from the point that realtors are lying, lowlife scumbags.

klarek says

There is nothing inconsistent with what I’m saying here and then

Of course there is. Personal responsibility means, among other things, not blaming others for your mistakes. Blaming a realtor because you bought a house at the top of a bubble is most certainly blaming another for your mistake.

tatupu70 says

Of course there is. Personal responsibility means, among other things, not blaming others for your mistakes.

Dumbass, they're not blaming their realtor. Reading comprehension FAIL.

klarek says

Dumbass, they’re not blaming their realtor. Reading comprehension FAIL.

Yes, but you are!

tatupu70 says

Yes, but you are!

Track back in this conversation to where I think it was RayAmerica said that realtors don't kill people, or some sort of desperate defense of the industry. My point was that they do hurt people. People I know that trusted their advice over my own and subsequently had to pay a serious price for it. That isn't me abdicating my friends and coworkers of their personal responsibility.

By trying to twist that argument, you're either suffering a severe case of mental impairment to the point that you lack any reading comprehension ability, or you're trying to split hairs with me out of bitterness.

klarek says

My point was that they do hurt people.

And my point was they don't hurt people. I'm not twisting anything. I have been accused of having a mental impairment, however. I'm a LIB after all, and just ask Abe. We're all mentally impaired.