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It’s Time to Stop Backing Ukraine


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2023 Sep 25, 2:04am   7,551 views  69 comments

by UkraineIsTotallyFucked   ➕follow (1)   💰tip   ignore  

There is no victory in this war. There are only bad and worse outcomes.

https://public.substack.com/p/its-time-to-stop-backing-ukraine



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31   Onvacation   2023 Sep 25, 7:23pm  

socal2 says

If there was truly a massive population in Ukraine that was pro-Russian or just apathetic to Russia's invasion wanting to end the war - we would have seen quite a bit of evidence of it now.

The Donbass and Crimea. They just want Zelenski to leave them alone.
32   richwicks   2023 Sep 25, 7:25pm  

socal2 says


I find it hilarious that Patnet's Russian boosters who have spent the last year making absolute concrete predictions time and time again of Russia's total success - only to be proven wrong repeatedly - are now questioning folks like me as to where I get my information.


Did I?

https://patrick.net/post/1343140/2021-12-29-a-ukraine-war-and-the-end-of-russia?start=1#comment-1808895


Who cares. The cabal that runs the United States is just killing all of us with these stupid wars. Russia will fight a war of attrition and just allow the US to continue to bankrupt the entire nation for something 99.99% of the US population has no stake in. The Middle East has been doing this for 2 decades now.

I bet if it came to war in Ukraine, Russia wouldn't even cut off their energy exports to Europe although the US might sabotage these pipelines and then attempt to blame Russia.

The United States is causing this conflict, not Russia. It's just another example of the insanity that runs this nation. The US has bombed 7 nations over the last 20 years - has this in any way benefited this nation?


Notice, I wrote that BEFORE Russia invaded on December 28, 2021. Russia went in on February 24, 2022.

I don't know much about Russia really, but I do know the United States quite well. Our state department always "fucks up", we either have the most astoundingly incompetent people in the state department, OR we have active saboteurs in it. Doesn't really matter either way, the intent doesn't matter, the result does, and the results are easy to predict. I've seen it 7 times in the last 20 years, and studied those 7 times.

I expect this to end like Vietnam and I expect the war to go on for at least, minimum, of 2 more years. Not an expert by any means on Vietnam either, but I know the Gulf of Tonkin was a false flag, and the Pentagon Papers showed the military knew LONG before the war ended, that there was no chance of prevailing in the war. Discord leaks (if you're to trust them) say the same thing, the military already knows Ukraine is a lost cause.

Engh, we'll find out and all the dickheads and assholes, they will never reflect on being wrong AGAIN. Neocon Chickhawk motherfuckers. They just keep "making mistakes" and deny they were fooled YET AGAIN. Fucking 20 years of this shit. These cattle are all around me. I know people who defend the Libyan bombing, or ONCE did. Now "I never said that!".
33   richwicks   2023 Sep 25, 8:02pm  

socal2 says


I would argue it is your side that is "clutching pearls" over Russia fearing Putin will nuke America or it is some sort of preposterous Satanic Globohomo conspiracy if Russia is not allowed to successfully invade and destroy their sovereign neighbor.


Just who is doing this? Name them.

I believe that there's zero chance that Ukraine will prevail in this conflict, and that Russia will ultimately set terms of the end of the war, after it goes on for years, and it wipes out Ukraine's military, and hence all their young fighting men. I expect Ukraine to be divided into West and East, and for the West to be under Russia's thumb from that point forward.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Russia enact an energy embargo on Europe, because why bother to try to trade with your enemy and I expect NATO to be significantly weakened, not that it has any actual use other than to launder money anyhow. NATO might even dissolve. The EU could POSSIBLY dissolve, but I doubt it.

Europe will be poorer, Russia will be richer, the US will be poorer. This war, like ALL the wars the US gets involved with just weakens the United States, causes inflation, and degrades the moral standing of the United States.


original link

The US is the world leader in hypocrisy and dishonesty. "A wholly unjustified, and brutal invasion of Iraq... I mean Ukraine. (Iraq too..)" - audience laughs - who the fuck is in the audience? Just fucking disgusting.

If you didn't catch it, George W. Bush in that video, precisely, described the United States. EVERYTHING he claimed Russia is doing, the United States is doing or has done.
34   AmericanKulak   2023 Sep 26, 1:12am  

Geopolitics doesn't change much depending on who is in office. Whomever replaces Putin will still be bound by geopolitical reality:

The Germans will always want to dominate Europe, The Russians will always want to hold the MacKinder Pivot and a buffer on the steppes and boglands going into Europe, But we are very free to do what's best at the time because of our geographic location, with plenty of prep time to rectify any mistakes.

Sadly, we don't take advantage of the latter and keep a ridiculously massive force on hand at all times, and are incredibly over-officered which is a massive expense as well. That's deliberate, since the Army wants more officers than command or staff needs in case of a big sudden draft, legacy of Cold War. It also means we are bloated with huge numbers of chubby trans-queer MBAs who couldn't lead a boy scout pack a mile out of a national forest with a map and compass. Then the consolidation of more and more contractors and congressional district job splitting and obsession with one-size-fits-all Intruder-Fighters like the F-35 garbage because the Air Force likes to shock and awe infrastructre bombing and not dogfight or do close air support. Even though the former has never ended any serious war.

BRRRRtttt mockers are invariably Lockheed bots and employees.
35   richwicks   2023 Sep 26, 1:21am  

AmericanKulak says

Sadly, we don't take advantage of the latter and keep a ridiculously massive force on hand at all times


Have I been hallucinating NATO this entire time? Hunh.
36   AmericanKulak   2023 Sep 26, 1:30am  

richwicks says


Have I been hallucinating NATO this entire time? Hunh.

North American Taxes/Troops Only standing and short-term ready unit strength is over half US forces, so no.

As we keep a ridiculously large force on hand at all times... which we shouldn't and don't need to do. But we do do.
37   richwicks   2023 Sep 26, 5:00am  

AmericanKulak says


richwicks says


Have I been hallucinating NATO this entire time? Hunh.

North American Taxes/Troops Only standing and short-term ready unit strength is over half US forces, so no.



So - NATO serves no purpose. If what you just said is what you believe, that's the conclusion isn't it?

AmericanKulak says



As we keep a ridiculously large force on hand at all times... which we shouldn't and don't need to do. But we do do.


It's just a way of laundering money, and paying off bribes.

You have no idea how corrupt our nation is. Our nation starts wars for congressmen to make money off from Offense Contractors. For THEM at least, they authorize wars to kill 100's of thousands for no other reason. They have absolutely no concern for the health of the nation.

You cannot understand what a sociopath really is, I do. That's who rules this nation. You cannot accept that somebody will engage in the most outrageous immorality for short term gain, our "leaders" do. It pisses me off to no end you can't comprehend this, because you think these fuckers must be like you. They aren't.
38   richwicks   2023 Sep 26, 5:12am  

Big_Johnson says


Russia invaded Ukraine. Russia is bombarding/shelling hospitals, schools, residential buildings.


Western Ukraine did this, for years, nobody complained:


original link

That's from here: https://www.cnn.com/2014/09/02/world/europe/ukraine-crisis/index.html

Don't claim your heart bleeds, because it doesn't. How do you think I know about this? Engh, when there's slavery in Libya, well, that's OK, even if the US caused it. That's my experience with the cattle. I'm not like you.

Big_Johnson says


Russia has a history of doing this. They invaded Finland in 1939 and bombarded Helsinki. Thank the universe russia didn’t succeed. One of the many wars Russia started and lost. Speaking of fools. One fool here was saying Russia never lost a war. Giant lol.


Who gives a shit? The US has attacked 7 nations in the last 20 years. You don't worry about that. You don't worry about it to such a point you can't even name the nations, much less the bullshit excuses the US has given for attacking them. I can't even name the bullshit reasons for Yemen and Somalia, because the Federal government has never justified it, because the public is entirely unaware of it.

Big_Johnson says


You can criticize the western countries as much as you want. They are the lesser evil IMO,


You can judge any fucking way you want. It's still evil, and you won't speak out against it because "there's a greater evil". Isn't that right?

Big_Johnson says


Why don’t you put your money/house where your mouth is and immigrate to Russia?


I am witnessing the collapse. I wouldn't go to Russia, I would go to South America if I wanted to escape it.

Big_Johnson says


Them attacking their neighbors doesn’t bother you and I am sure they will love your anti-western rhetoric. You might be welcomed with open arms and they might offer you a lead position in their propaganda.


They don't need anything from me. They are in the same position the United States was 40 years ago, all they need to do for "propaganda" is to tell the truth about the US government. They don't need to distort, much less lie.

Remember, "Russia hacked our elections" and "Hunter Biden's laptop was Russian disinformation". The absolute stupidest fools believe this. I just gave people far too much credit. I though people just didn't bother to think, but when it's so easy to think, they still repeat the dumbest fucking propaganda. I have vastly over-estimated people all my life. They are stupid.

You seem to think my belief in this stupid fucking war, that Ukraine will win, will make any difference. It's psychotic. If I believe harder will they win? That appears to be what you believe, and if I don't believe in their victory, I'm a traitor. I suppose you believe in Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny still as well. My assessment is devoid of what I want to happen. It's very predictable. We have stupid Neocon fuckheads who are either traitors to this nation or incompetents running our foreign policy, of course this proxy war will fail. All their wars do.

The closest we came to a victory was Iraq - what did the US win? How did this advantage our nation? You have no idea, but you still stupidly support the next dumb fucking war even though it hurts everybody, unless you're some fucking piece of shit working for the murder industrial complex.
39   Onvacation   2023 Sep 26, 5:20am  

Big_Johnson says

Why don’t you put your money/house where your mouth is and immigrate to Russia?

Why don't you volunteer to fight for Ukraine?

Those that ignore history are heading for disaster. Ukraine is as corrupt as the Biden administration. "If the prosecutor is not fired, you're not getting the money." Well, son of a bitch. He got fired.'"
40   richwicks   2023 Sep 26, 5:25am  

Onvacation says


Big_Johnson says


Why don’t you put your money/house where your mouth is and immigrate to Russia?

Why don't you volunteer to fight for Ukraine?

Those that ignore history are heading for disaster. Ukraine is as corrupt as the Biden administration. "If the prosecutor is not fired, you're not getting the money." Well, son of a bitch. He got fired.'"



He'll no more fight for Ukraine than I would for Russia.

It's easy to send off gullible fools to war, it's quite a bit harder to say there should be no war.

If I were to pick up a gun to kill somebody, I'd kill a banker first, and if that didn't work, go to a politician. I don't think it would make any difference. You have to cut the head off the snake, and I still can't exactly identify the head.

After all, what's my problem with Russians? I have none, but my government creates problems between countries. Now if I could eliminate them...

If I was confident I could fix the problem with murder, I would. I have zero confidence I can fix the problem. It's far more complex than I understand and even if I did, I doubt I'd have any chance of success. It would just be a messy way to commit suicide, and I know the media, the would deify anybody I murdered, and it would absolutely be a murder.

I think I have to just observe and notice. I'm limited to that.
41   richwicks   2023 Sep 26, 5:40am  

Big_Johnson says


Why don’t you volunteer to fight for Russia? You could kill Ukrainian woman and children. Except they don’t take people over the age of 80 to fight for them. Btw., how old are you exactly?


Is it really beyond your capacity of mind to believe that a person wants nobody killed?

You're creating a false dichotomy. You are knowingly do this.

The sane desire is to end the war, you're the one promoting a war, but you're uninvolved. If you want to promote war, kill in one, or die in one, or both.

Ukraine is highly unlikely to be victorious in this conflict, if this is what happenes, all lives that were lost in the war, were lost for nothing. Russia will have gotten what they wanted and Ukraine would have lost whatever they wanted (and that is very unspecified). The result will just be a lot of dead bodies.

But your body won't be counted among them, will they?
42   NuttBoxer   2023 Sep 26, 6:54am  

Trollhole says


It’s Time to Stop Backing Ukraine


Gravy train doesn't stop until US is reduced to third world status. Money for foreigners, none for East Palestine, none for Maui.
43   RayAmerica   2023 Sep 26, 8:41am  

The Ukraine War ... Myth vs Reality

Myth:

Russia's invasion of Ukraine is an unprovoked war of aggression. Russia is an evil nation that is out to conquer Europe, and probably, the world. If we don't stop their unjust invasion of Ukraine, we'll eventually be fighting them in Europe and possibly even over here.

Reality:

The USA guaranteed an eventual invasion of Ukraine when, after the collapse of the USSR, the promise made to Gorbachev by George H. W. Bush & Sec. of State James Baker not to expand NATO by "one inch" was dramatically broken with NATO expanding in a manner that virtually surrounded Russia. Then, in 2013/14, a coup was orchestrated by the U. S. Government to remove from power the Ukraine Government that just so happened to be friendly with Russia.

Myth:

Ukraine is winning the war. They will not only kick the Russians out of Ukraine, but also will capture Crimea. They only need more money and armaments in order to finish what will surely be a victory for Ukraine.

Reality:

Ukraine never had a chance in defeating Russia, as in NEVER. Furthermore, Putin has waged a very limited, controlled warfare, as evidenced by the fact that had he desired to destroy Ukraine he would have, due to Russia's overwhelming fire power.

Ukraine's much vaunted spring offensive, by all accounts, is a complete, utter failure. To date, the small nation of Ukraine has lost over *400,000 soldiers and counting. That kind of loss is unsustainable, illustrated by the fact that Ukraine is so desperate for fighting men that they are forcefully capturing men off of the streets, giving them a rifle, and sending them immediately to the front lines, only to fight against seasoned, professional, well-equipped Russian forces. Ukraine soldiers are on record describing the ongoing slaughter of these poorly trained Ukraine amateur soldiers.

* To put this military death toll in perspective, all of the military deaths suffered by the USA, in both the Pacific and in Europe, amounted to an estimated 407,000. At the outbreak of World War II, the population of the USA was estimated to be about 150 million. The current population of Ukraine is approximately 29 million. Obviously, the per capita death toll for Ukraine is astronomical in comparison to the losses of the USA in all of World War II.
44   RWSGFY   2023 Sep 26, 9:07am  

Interesting timing: right after Red Fleet in the Black Sea was tricemated and its commaners killled it's SUDDENLY time to surrender to the mighty USSR. The vaginisation of some self-proclaimed "conservatives" is astounding. Reagan is rolling in his grave.

If anything it's time to abandon Obamaesque limpdicking and Brandonesque foot -dragging and deliver the necessary long-range weaponry in quantity. It's obvious that all the chickenclucking about Pukin's "redlines" wrt hits at Crimea and Soviet territory proper (including Moscow) was just manifestations of weak minds and lack of cojones. Want this war to end? Give all the necessary tools to these who have the balls to fight.
46   socal2   2023 Sep 26, 9:34am  

RWSGFY says

Interesting timing: right after Red Fleet in the Black Sea was tricemated and its commaners killled it's SUDDENLY time to surrender to the mighty USSR. The vaginisation of some self-proclaimed "conservatives" is astounding. Reagan is rolling in his grave.


They are not Conservatives.

Mostly a mix of 9/11 Troofers, anti-Semites, Birchers, Islamist apologists and people who have been radicalized by the treatment of Trump.

They are not agnostic claiming they just want to see the killing stopped and economic security restored. Some are gleefully cheering on Russia's invasion and celebrating Ukraine's death toll.

Same fuckers will be cheering for Communist China if/when they invade Taiwan claiming America provoked it.
47   komputodo   2023 Sep 26, 11:04am  

Big_Johnson says

“Same fuckers will be cheering for Communist China if/when they invade Taiwan claiming America provoked it”

Lol. Exactly.

And if China commitments war crimes it will be pointed out that the US did something in Yemen or Libya.

have you ever considered focusing on the myriad of problems plaguing the US instead of countries half way around the world? just askin'
48   RayAmerica   2023 Sep 26, 11:21am  

Part of the $113 Billion so far goes to pay the following:

America is paying the salaries of 57,000 Ukrainian first responders.

While Biden continues to ignore the huge shortfalls in the Social Security surplus fund, America is paying the pensions for Ukrainians.

The U. S. government continues to ignore the invasion taking place on our southern border which will eventually overwhelm our system. Yet, many Americans ignore this, while they enthusiastically support the sure to fail war efforts of Ukraine. Amazing!
49   socal2   2023 Sep 26, 1:50pm  

komputodo says

have you ever considered focusing on the myriad of problems plaguing the US instead of countries half way around the world? just askin'


Sure. I think we can walk and chew gum at the same time.

I am not wigging out over Ukraine thinking Russia will nuke us or worry that Europe will freeze to death like some folks here at Patnet have been confidently predicting this past year. I am perfectly fine sending excess and mothballed weapons to Ukrainians if they are willing to defend their territory and keep one our chief economic/military rivals tied up in attritional warfare.

If it causes North Korea and Iran to bleed out their weapons stores by shipping them to Russia - all the better!

The military aid we have provided Ukraine is the best ROI we have gotten from our massively bloated military budget in my entire lifetime!
50   UkraineIsTotallyFucked   2023 Sep 26, 2:20pm  

socal2 says

Sure. I think we can walk and chew gum at the same time.


Except we won't/can't.

So it's time to force the issue: hold Ukey Nazi support hostage in Congress until we get what we want. At the very least
51   Onvacation   2023 Sep 26, 7:20pm  

Schokolade says

Those myths you are stating are what I believe to be true instead.

It’s all a BS discussion anyways. let’s just agree to disagree.

Whatever happened to that Ostrich Button?
52   UkraineIsTotallyFucked   2023 Sep 26, 7:28pm  

Schokolade says

Just because you call it facts doesn’t mean it’s a fact.


Then you write this:

Schokolade says

We can be happy we are not being attacked by a madman like Putin


You're just trolling this site. Go away.

@Patrick ^^^ he's antagonizing the hell out of multiple ppl by engaging in disingenuous dialog whenever any of us call him out for his inconsistencies. A fucking troll. #UkeyNaziFluffer
53   richwicks   2023 Sep 26, 7:30pm  

Schokolade says


Richwicks, you keep mentioning the US and Libya, Yemen etc. to be honest, that doesn’t bother me one bit.


Yeah, I know there's a lot of sociopaths that don't give a shit about the US federal government bankrupting the entire fucking country to start wars that have NOTHING to do with US interests, that kill millions.

I know it doesn't bother subhuman things at all. I'm very well aware of that. I have tried for decades to believe these meat machines around me are human, but the last 3 years, that just broke me. You're cattle.

Schokolade says


Those are shithole countries and controlled by Muslim radicals. I remember what Ted Cruz said, make the sand glow.


Saudi Arabia is controlled by a criminal crime syndicate family - the Sa'ud family. They are Wahhabis. Those are Muslims radicals.

You don't have a problem with the US' close relationship with them, because you never bothered to think about it, and IF YOU DID, you made up some bullshit excuse as to why it was excusable, but it wasn't consistent. You're just a hypocrite. You have no values or principles or standards. I do. Isn't that alien and strange to you? I bet I'm like a circus freak to you, "look mommy! The ape that has some fucking moral principles!"

Saudi Arabia took Jamal Khashoggi, murdered him, cut his body up into pieces in their Turkish embassy. Oh, but look over there, or there or there.

Our government colludes with monsters, because our government is monstrous.

No conflict for you. You have no problem with this, DO YOU? I mean, what is a moral principle? YOU have no idea.

Schokolade says


Russia attacking Ukraine bothers me though. Ukraine is too close to my other home (europe).


Oh god. Read this:

https://americandissident.substack.com/p/why-i-think-the-united-states-overthrew

You have no idea what is going on, or what could have been done to prevent it. I do.

Ignorance at one point was something imposed upon people, today, it's a fucking sin. You have a responsibility to know what is going on and you're a complete failure in this.

Schokolade says


I love the US. It’s people and culture. It’s the best country in the world. I could never see myself as a Russian booster. Doesn’t make any sense to me. What’s your attraction with Russia?


God. I oppose war. That doesn't mean I love Russia, obviously.

Here's what is going to happen. Nearly every Ukrainian that was unfortunate enough to be part of the military is either going to die, or be so mauled, they can never returned to active duty.

The country is likely to be split in half, and over time, who knows, Eastern European nations might start absorbing lands.

All of this could have been prevented, if Ukraine just ended their stupid fucking civil war. That was what the Minsky Accords were about, it's what Zelenskyy, a fucking Jewish traitor who HATES Ukraine, promised to do. That's why he was elected.

When this is over, Ukrainians are going to DESPISE Jews.
54   richwicks   2023 Sep 26, 7:37pm  

Schokolade says


Our problems are peanuts compared to what Ukraine is going through. The funds we invest to help Ukraine is a drop in the bucket.


OK - fine.

Let's have a drop in the bucket for

* people in Flint Michigan
* people in Palestine Ohio
* people in Maui

People in Ukraine get more fucking money than the people Maui did - $700 per household. I'm in full favor of revolution at this point.

Our government's responsibility is to serve the public good. If they can't do that, and they refuse to do it, fire them, or kill them. I'd prefer just to fire them, but I'm not above guillotines and heads on stakes. These mother fucker sociopaths, and just asking for it.
55   Patrick   2023 Sep 26, 7:42pm  

Trollhole says

he's antagonizing the hell out of multiple ppl by engaging in disingenuous dialog whenever any of us call him out for his inconsistencies


If he's not deliberately insulting other users, why not just refuse to engage?
56   Onvacation   2023 Sep 26, 7:47pm  

RWSGFY says

it's time to abandon Obamaesque limpdicking and Brandonesque foot -dragging and deliver the necessary long-range weaponry in quantity.

Why do you want thermonuclear war?
57   UkraineIsTotallyFucked   2023 Sep 26, 8:26pm  

Schokolade says


Having a different opinion is not trolling. There are a few people here who are not Russian boosters. And what you quoted there is not an inconsistency. I bet if you would live close to Russia (say in Lithuania, Finnland or Poland) you would think very differently about this Russian threat. Why are you getting so personal, angry and emotional about the subject?


Stop the fucking trolling bullshit. It is sooo obvious now.

Once your trolling gets outed, it is just a waste of time on your part to continue.
58   richwicks   2023 Sep 26, 8:45pm  

Schokolade says


Richwicks, you are saying the US planted the Ukrainian government (puppets) and caused this war, right? You base this on this leaked phone call from 2014 w/ Nuland or do you have any other indications?


Yes, I am.

Victoria Nuland with Geoffrey Pyatt picked out the government of Ukraine, and that's the government Ukraine ending up getting, WHAT A COINCIDENCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!#@!$#@$%#@!$^%@!#$ This phone call was leaked on February 4th, 2014 and the Yanukovych government collapsed on February 22, 2014.

How could Victorial Nuland know that the government would have to be replaced IF she was acting as a diplomat, and not a fucking piece of shit spy? More importantly, what was Victoria Nuland doing picking out the next government to replace the current one? It's supposed to be a democratic republic, isn't it? Shouldn't the people of Ukraine be picking?

This, is by far, the most obvious coup in history, that was exposed, before the coup.

What proof do YOU need? Some document that comes out from an FOIA request 30 years from now? I have seen people deny this blatant evidence. They may as well be telling me that the red hot stove isn't warm and safe to handle. I don't believe anybody can be this stupid, but I do believe, and in fact know, there are people that will be this dishonest - to simply deny obvious reality. I'm tired of this shit.

If you deny the coup, that's just silly. It's childish. Do you think just because assholes in my government claim that this leaked phone call (that's been confirmed to be real) had no bearing on Ukraine's government, that I'll believe it? 2+2=4. It's not 3, it's not 5, I don't give a shit what the state tells me it is.

Now if you're a pathetic, cow, you can believe whatever they tell you. I'm serious when I say I don't any longer regard 90% of humanity as human. I'm not kidding. I won't kill them, I won't harm them. I was a vegetarian for 25 years, I have empathy. I used to do dog rescue, I would take incredibly broken messed up dogs, and get them to see what a wondrous nice world existed. But I'd still whack them if they showed violence, if they eliminated in my home. I didn't do this to be mean, I did this to correct them ONCE. Only once was generally necessary.

YOU can't be trained. Dogs I couldn't train NOT to be violent, I put down - I failed once out of 20 dogs and I still feel badly about it, it was a failure. But, I'll leave you alone. You're not a dog, you can't be corrected, you can't be fixed and I'm not going to rescue you, or show you a better side of existence.

I had a wolf in rescue. That's not a dog. I had a full arctic wolf. That animal couldn't be trained, but wasn't dangerous, but was NOT a dog. You're more like that but I don't know, you might be dangerous. I just got lucky this animal wasn't dangerous, but he could be. That animal could have easily killed me, he just didn't because he didn't want to kill me. Just like I didn't want to kill him. What would be the motive?
59   richwicks   2023 Sep 26, 8:53pm  

Schokolade says


Why is Zelenskyy a Jewish traitor and hates Ukraine??


He promised to implement the Minsk Accords, and end the civil war, and he didn't. Instead he escalated it, got Russia to finally attack Eastern Ukraine, and has dumped 300,000 or so Ukrainian into the meat grinder. He's destroyed Ukraine.

Schokolade says


Btw., all the personal comments and name callings don’t bother me in your case. I think it’s because I believe you just went too far down the rabbit hole.


HOW am I wrong? Maybe I am. When you think you have found an error in either my logic or knowledge, point it out. I'm human, I make errors, and I will accept it when I do, and correct. I've been doing this all my life.

I'm just disgusted with you. I know how this war will end, because it will end like EVERY American war. YOU SHOULD KNOW, and you don't. What? Can't learn the basics in 20 fucking years? This war will end with a lot of dead, and a destroyed nation, and if anybody gains, it will be US companies shipping LNG to Europe, and Russia. I almost think this war is really a war against Europe.

Russia will be fine after this, the US.... I don't know.
60   AmericanKulak   2023 Sep 26, 9:13pm  

Trollhole says





Wow, Maui is really bad.

Oh wait, only a few million for US disasters.
61   richwicks   2023 Sep 28, 4:00am  

@StillsearchingforagoodName - you asked me what I based my belief on Ukraine being overthrown by a CIA coup and I told you, that the intercepted phone call between Victoria Nuland and Geoffrey Pyatt was not just evidence for the coup, but absolute proof.

Do you consider this to be erroneous?

You seem to think that Victoria Nuland deciding on the government that Ukraine was going to have (and got), is just some sort of coincidence. Are you really incapable of not believing in something until some taking head asshole says it?

For the first time in history, not only did we get evidence of a coup before it happened, we had a recorded conversation that Victoria Nuland admitted was accurate and correct, and simply because our asshole propagandists won't confirm it, you don't believe it? It's amazing to me how absolutely brainwashed people can be.

I want to be clear about my position. I think the US state department is out of control by maniacs, and I mean literal maniacs. They should all be fired if not imprisoned or executed. They purpose create problems, and they use the propaganda box to offer a solution. We didn't have to go to ANY WAR since 1991. I'm tired of this shit. Ukraine was corrupt in 2013, and it's corrupt now. It's not our problem, and more importantly, the US isn't solving that problem, they are exploiting it and I'm fucking paying for it, and so is everybody.

20 fucking years of war, of state sanctioned murder, ignore the immorality of it, how has ANY of these wars advantaged our nation? We either have incompetents running the state department, or traitors running it. They are destroying this nation. Stop being a puppet to them. You are helping to destroy this nation, by being loyal. Stop being a loyal puppet. I'm tired of it. We should have revolted decades ago.
62   Tenpoundbass   2023 Sep 28, 8:44am  

iwog2 says

Schokolade says

Just because you call it facts doesn’t mean it’s a fact.

Then you write this:

Schokolade says

We can be happy we are not being attacked by a madman like Putin

You're just trolling this site. Go away.


How is that Trolling, seems like a low bar to me. People call Putin a madman all the time in their support for Ukraine.
If you're already triggered by their first defense for supporting Ukraine, then you have already lost the debate.

I support Putin over the EU and Global Domination NGO cabal, and their G20 enablers.
I can only go by logical optics for my opinion and support. He may be a bigger asshole than I give him credit for. But however the MSM's dishonest selective reporting. And those attacking him, if critical thinking prevails, Those that are attacked the most, are probably on the side of the Truth of what's going on. That being said, I don't or can't get bent out of shape over people calling him a madman, because that's their only defense for the NWO.
Otherwise they can't tell me how Putin is doing anything worse than the rest of Western World's influence and military enforced policy.
63   Shaman   2023 Sep 28, 9:39am  

The Russo/Ukrainian war can best be described as a civil war between adjoining and neighboring states with a history of conflict.
Which civil war in history was NOT inflamed to greater body counts and longer duration with more destruction by the addition of foreign money and arms?

There’s a reason we lock up international arms dealers. They prolong such violence and cause thousands of needless deaths by arming the belligerent forces.

This all could have been over in April 2022, but Biden and the elites wanted to “hurt Russia” with their cat’s paw Ukraine.
It’s cost half a million lives, and those weren’t Sudanese Africans nobody cares about. Those are white Christians who are dying in droves for the vanity of the “Rich Men North of Richmond.”
64   socal2   2023 Sep 28, 11:06am  

Shaman says

It’s cost half a million lives, and those weren’t Sudanese Africans nobody cares about. Those are white Christians who are dying in droves for the vanity of the “Rich Men North of Richmond.”


This implies that Ukrainians have no agency and are not volunteering to defend their country from a hostile invader.

Where is the evidence that the majority of Ukrainians want their government and military disbanded and to accept living under Russian occupation?
65   Onvacation   2023 Sep 28, 11:14am  

socal2 says

This implies that Ukrainians have no agency and are not volunteering to defend their country from a hostile invader.

If the Ukrainians have so many volunteers, why do they recruit by press gang?
66   socal2   2023 Sep 28, 11:56am  

Onvacation says

socal2 says


This implies that Ukrainians have no agency and are not volunteering to defend their country from a hostile invader.

If the Ukrainians have so many volunteers, why do they recruit by press gang?


FFS - virtually any country suffering a massive invasion from Russia like Ukraine is experiencing would have to institute Martial Law and set up a conscription system. There were loads of patriotic US volunteers after Pearl Harbor, but we still needed a draft.

Besides, if Russia is so successful in their invasion, why are they having to call up mobilizations and pathetically use criminals like Wagner to go next door and get killed?
67   Onvacation   2023 Sep 28, 12:44pm  

socal2 says

FFS - virtually any country suffering a massive invasion from Russia like Ukraine is experiencing would have to institute Martial Law and set up a conscription system.

Drag them off the corner give them a rifle and send them into Russian mine fields is conscription?
68   UkraineIsTotallyFucked   2023 Sep 28, 8:40pm  

Ukey Bullshit Counter-offensive Paid By You And Me.

We were promised that they would be at the Sea of Azov MONTHS ago.


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