patrick.net

Obama and the Dems simply follow the centuries of grifter wisdom: show money, promise something for nothing, make a vested third party the crook and steal with righteous indignation. They know that by promising something for nothing, you can rob everybody blind, including the people who voted for you. They walk away with the oyster and the dumb, acey-deucey voters are left with the shells.

When Obama loses the reins of power, the facade will crumble because the media machine that protects him now will be free to "expose" him with impunity for the falsehoods that they knew all along. The paper mache fake will probably spend the rest of his life on the run mired in litigation. He may wind up our first ex-patriate president living in some other sanctuary state, a disgraced international ham. Every policy made during his administrations will become retractable and repealable.

But until then, all hail Saint Barry, the liberator and great equalizer!

It is truly frightening that a fake can actually be elected. I guess the future is a "Max Headroom" cyber modelled politician with no underlying reality at all because voters can't think past the image.

marcus says

JohnLaw says

I know the world isn't flat Politicofact because I have probably seen a heck of a lot more of it than you have.

It shows what you know!

Like Marcus says:

marcus says

But if you are not a total dimwit then you must comprehend that everything that is not outright right wing plutocracy/corporatocracy is not marxism.

Your a little off John.

For the record John, I am very well traveled. Thanks.

Ceffer says

The paper mache fake will probably spend the rest of his life on the run mired in litigation. He may wind up our first ex-patriate president living in some other sanctuary state, a disgraced international ham. Every policy made during his administrations will become retractable and repealable.

But until then, all hail Saint Barry, the liberator and great equalizer!

You lead a very rich fantasy life, and you take right wing lies to an entirely new level I've never seen before.

Blame the way ALL politics is financed for corruption and cronyism you see. And it is by no means as bad on the left as it is on the right.

But then we have to have a system where money funds politics right ? How else can we have a plutocracy / corporatocracy where the government is owned by the wealthy and the corporations ? And yet you want to blame those who fight from within this corrupt and broken system for something that more closely resembles democracy ?

This stuff isn't rocket science.

Ceffer says

When Obama loses the reins of power, the facade will crumble because the media machine that protects him now will be free to "expose" him with impunity for the falsehoods that they knew all along.

SPOT ON

Reader says

Ceffer says

When Obama loses the reins of power, the facade will crumble because the media machine that protects him now will be free to "expose" him with impunity for the falsehoods that they knew all along.

You mean like the way the "LEFT or RIGHT MEDIA" exposed George Bush's 8yrs of misery? I don't think so.

You see , your wrong.

The only freedom I have as a voter is to pick the lesser of two evils, and Obama ain't it.

Ceffer says

The only freedom I have as a voter is to pick the lesser of two evils, and Obama ain't it.

lol did you forget Bush ! do you even know Romney?

What planet are you living on? It certainly is not this one.

Ceffer says

The only freedom I have as a voter is to pick the lesser of two evils....

That's really unfair to the independent party candidates who are risking their lives campaigning to offer you a choice. If you dislike ObamneyCare, it makes no sense to replace the second person who signed it with the first person who signed the same thing. You do have the freedom to choose other candidates, e.g. former Governor Gary Johnson (Libertarian) or Jill Stein MD (Green), both of whom oppose ObamneyCare and neither of whom ever signed anything like it.

marcus says

But then we have to have a system where money funds politics right ? How else can we have a plutocracy / corporatocracy where the government is owned by the wealthy and the corporations ? And yet you want to blame those who fight from within this corrupt and broken system for something that more closely resembles democracy ?

So what's the best solution?

My current thinking is that publicly financed elections and a ban on private campaign donations would do a lot to help.

But it will be hard getting Congressmen to vote for publicly financed elections when they all got elected under the current private money corrupt system.

Politicofact says

Your a little off John.

I consider that a compliment coming from you PoliticoCommie.

If these Liberal horn blowing "Activist" were to actually find them selves in need of Obama's promises and claims of accomplishments. I bet they would turn into Rush Limbaugh over night. Obama is really enjoying a cacoon buffer from the noise touting Obama's accomplishment solely based his signature.
He signed it so it must be so.

If these guys were to actually need Mortgage deduction, they would find that's just smoke and mirror fanfare pandering to their socialist fanboys.

Try Googling Cervical Cancer, Existing Condition, no Insurance.
You'll get a site for Pre-Existing Condition Insurance Plan (PCIP) but you'll really have to dig for it, that to date only has 500K users(so it claims).
You'll need to be uninsured for 6 months, and have a cronic preexisting condition. Which also means if you don't have insurance, never have had insurance. But were told by a doctor you have 6 months to live with out starting treatment right away. They will still have to apply for 2 other insurance companies wait 3 month each to turn you down. And you can't apply at the same time, you must apply one after the other. Then you may apply for PCIP.

I wont even ask to google the horror stories about the quality of care. Like you have to go to the pharmacy and buy chemo drugs to bring to the chemotherapy. And the out of pocket is anything but affordable in most States.

These are the people Obama starts every speech touting the 500,000 with preexisting conditions more insured now than before Obamacare.

Where's the factcheck on that, can we get a pants on fire from the Clowns in Tampa?

curious2 says

Ceffer says

The only freedom I have as a voter is to pick the lesser of two evils....

That's really unfair to the independent party candidates who are risking their lives campaigning to offer you a choice. If you dislike ObamneyCare, it makes no sense to replace the second person who signed it with the first person who signed the same thing. You do have the freedom to choose other candidates, e.g. former Governor Gary Johnson (Libertarian) or Jill Stein MD (Green), both of whom oppose ObamneyCare and neither of whom ever signed anything like it.

You are absolutely correct. I applaud the courage of those who will operate outside of the usual channels of political sponsership.

However, the practical matter is that by shifting pluralities, a single voter may just as well vote for whom he does not want in office. Bottom line, you wind up with two choices and you can only vote for the one that you deem the better of two poor choices.

So what's the best solution?

To some extent, the problem has continued since at least the 19th century. For a while, I hoped the Internet might solve it, as more people have access to more information; it hasn't worked yet, but it is leading to improvement. I think it may take a generation, as more people have access to online education for example.

I respect people who advocate campaign finance reform, but to me it seems the equivalent of putting a Band-Aid(tm) on a deep wound. It covers the most obvious part of the problem, but doesn't necessarily solve anything. There are endless ways to convert money into power and back again, they are linked as inextricably as electricity and magnetism.

The deeper wound is cultural, with people hopelessly divided along sectarian lines. This may change as the Republicans begin to lose their "culture wars," but those may then be superseded by tribal divisions instead.

Real progress in healthcare (not ObamneyCare) might turn the tide. Today people worry about losing their life savings to a single illness or injury, due to America's opaque and overpriced medical industrial complex. That drives a lot of litigation, because people are forced to sue over injuries that in other countries would simply be treated for free or at low cost. The higher the cost, the more likely it is to result in litigation, which then further divides people against each other and exacerbates the culture of fear and mistrust. Frightened and mistrustful people are easily divided and misruled.

Anyway, perhaps this is very American of me, I keep hoping technological progress will solve the problems of today. Though doubtless it will create the problems of tomorrow.

marcus says

But if you are not a total dimwit then you must comprehend that everything that is not outright right wing plutocracy/corporatocracy is not marxism.

But you will continue suggesting that it is. This leaves everyone but the dimbulbs who lap up right wing propaganda to an obvious conclusion about your lack of intellect and common sense (regardless of what you have seen).

Marcus, the use of ad hominen attacks clearly betrays your complete lack of intellect. So what is it specifically about what are you disagreeing with? Do you need further clarification on some point?

JohnLaw says

Why should I care what a Brit thinks about American politics? The Marxist cancer that has spread from Europe will bring Obama down but not in time for the election. Hodge's assumption about the economy being on the mend is foolish and ignorant. The only thing holding up the house of cards that passes for the USSA economy is unadulterated monetary stimulus of the same variety that brought down the USSR. This speed fix will end in a hard crash and the public will be begging for anybody but the current idiotic, narcissistic poser and his handlers. No, it will be a huge boon for Republicans and Libertarians to have Obama re-elected. The blame will fall squarely on the one in charge when the real crash hits.

Unfortunately, most people don't see it. They call it "forward" even an giant iceberg is in the way.

It was just a few decades ago, that a republican-Nixon of all critters-slapped import taxes on all imports, because he felt the balance of trade was going against us.

Whatever happened?

Ceffer says

Dems simply follow the centuries of grifter wisdom: show money, promise something for nothing, make a vested third party the crook and steal with righteous indignation.

Damn that was beautiful.

I've come to the conclusion, that debate on healthcare right now is about garnering the loyalty of the profits and monetizing the politics to be made going forward in a Obamacare America. Republicans could have all voted against it in the first place and Justice Stevens could have called the whole thing unconstitutional. There's a lot of votes to be made from a fucked up political system intertwined with a taxation disquised as Healthcare.

Liberals have the media and education, Conservatives have/had the financial sector and religion.

So what's the best solution?

I think term limits on Congress critters would be a good start. Limit them to a combined total of 12 years in either house. I disagree with public financed elections. If government is financing its own elections you will only get more government. I think a better approach is to limit all campaign contributions to individuals and ban all union, corporate and other special interest lobbyist money from elections. Allow only registered voters to contribute and then they must, as they do now, publicly disclose their contribution.

JohnLaw says

I think a better approach is to limit all campaign contributions to individuals...

So then you and the billionaires would be on the same footing? No, you wouldn't.

The whole point is not to let money buy elections, but to actually have a democracy instead.

CaptainShuddup says

Conservatives have/had the financial sector and religion.

I think the financial sector has captured both parties (Robert Rubin, Barney Frank, Christopher Dodd). Lets face it, they could not have pulled off the biggest heist in the history of the world without complete control of the government. As for religion, I think its mixed. Most mainstream religions are split. Its only the religious right that has taken root in some conservative circles. A lot of conservatives are not comfortable with their influence. The area you didn't mention is the military industrial complex. That seems to be both parties gig. The neocons are the worst war mongers but it seems that everyone loves a good war.

So then you and the billionaires would be on the same footing? No, you wouldn't.

There are already limits on the amounts of individual contributions, I'm not advocating eliminating them. Also, I just wanted to clarify one point about a "democracy". We were founded as a Republic, not a democracy. I think that is an important distinction.

http://www.fec.gov/pages/brochures/contriblimits.shtml

JohnLaw says

lso, I just wanted to clarify one point about a "democracy". We were founded as a Republic, not a democracy.

The two are not mutually exclusive. The US is supposed to be a republic that is a democracy. You know, "of the people, by the people, for the people."

Things have moved steadily even more toward: by the rich and the corporations for the rich and the corporations.

Politicofact says

Reader says

Ceffer says

When Obama loses the reins of power, the facade will crumble because the media machine that protects him now will be free to "expose" him with impunity for the falsehoods that they knew all along.

You mean like the way the "LEFT or RIGHT MEDIA" exposed George Bush's 8yrs of misery? I don't think so.

You see , your wrong.

As you clearly have a belief, also understand and accept that there are people who do not believe with you. We too have a belief that we will follow ruthlessly and faithlessly to our graves.

Your parties beliefs are consistently based in fiction

THE ONLY BELIEF YOU HAVE IS THAT YOU ARE RIGHT!

Politicofact says

Your parties beliefs are consistently based in fiction

THE ONLY BELIEF YOU HAVE IS THAT YOU ARE RIGHT!

You are to me a sad piece of work.

Reader says

Politicofact says

Your parties beliefs are consistently based in fiction

THE ONLY BELIEF YOU HAVE IS THAT YOU ARE RIGHT!

You are to me a sad piece of work.

Reader

TROLL