patrick.net

I'm surprised about the animosity towards realtors.

There's good and bad in any profession....and there are subjective likes and dislikes.

Take some time to discover the best for you - generally, anyone with less than 5 years experience should be avoided. If the agent has made it past that hump, they have the acumen to have built business despite the large obstacles in the way the first 5 years of business.

After that, it would seem to simply be a personality that suits your needs and wants.

For what it's worth, one of my best buds here in San Fran is a BIGGIE realtor....he's VERY successful (residential and commercial properties). He's a totally sharp, and unerringly honest, guy - with 4 great kids and wife. He set me up with his financier of choice and has given me choice advice the past few months while we've looked for a home. I cannot thank him enough for his input.

However, he's not our (buying) agent. Because I recognized my wife will be handling most of the house chatter and visits, we found one more suitable (for us). A totally buttoned up lady just down the street - unerringly positive and forthright - was our pick and I have to say it's been a fine choice throughout.

You have a choice - choice wisely in what's best for you - and take some measure of responsibility in the deal. If you're involved, it's your money (and or house), so make certain the end result is one that you are happy with.

jsmarket says

I'm surprised about the animosity towards realtors.

C'mon now. After the last 15 disastrous, corruption plagued years regarding housing sales and you're "surprised"? I got news for you bud...... the animosity isn't just here. It's everywhere.

You Lowlife says

jsmarket says

I'm surprised about the animosity towards realtors.

C'mon now. After the last 15 disastrous, corruption plagued years regarding housing sales and you're "surprised"? I got news for you bud...... the animosity isn't just here. It's everywhere.

I've found animosity often fills the void where responsibility should've been.

So, are realtors dramatically worse than they've ever been - or are people sloughing off their role and responsibility for any mess they may have been involved with?

If one has even 1% role in any decision, you could've changed the outcome. Instead, one whines about 'the others' poor habits. Social media such as Patrick.net, Facebook, and Blogosphere has made it easier than ever to shirk one's culpability.

It's your life - we all make good choices and bad ones - those that learn from both are all too rare.

jsmarket says

I've found animosity often fills the void where responsibility should've been.

Oh puleez.

NAR failed the public in every way possible. They're the problem, they've been the problem and based on their perpetual shirking of responsibility, they'll continue to be the problem.

Realtors are generally useless. They are currently enjoying a monopoly, so they can eke out a living while providing no real benefit.

Stating the above opinion isn't whining, displacing blame, or any crap like that. It is the pessimist that thinks we need a 6% Realtor tax to be able to buy and sell houses to each other. Any optimist would think that we can achieve such a simple task on our own much quicker than finding an honest Realtor.

jsmarket says

've found animosity often fills the void where responsibility should've been.

So, are realtors dramatically worse than they've ever been - or are people sloughing off their role and responsibility for any mess they may have been involved with?

I wouldn't take what anonymous posters say too seriously. If they post like a 13 year old they just might be, or you may just be entertaining an immature unemployed adult living in their parents garage. People who can't get the system to work for them tend to hate the system they can't figure out how to make work for them.

Every successful investor I've trained either has a Realtor they work closely with or have gotten licensed themselves. Having to rely on services like Redifin for your MLS is going to severely impair your competitiveness.

jsmarket says

I'm surprised about the animosity towards realtors.

Name one profession where every thing that professional says is 100% lies? It seems like you are clueless about the Realtor tactics. They are not even professionals. It is pathetic and down side of USA that here they make 6% of the sale price for doing nothing compared to other professionals where they have to work hard to earn.

bubblesitter says

Name one profession where every thing that professional says is 100% lies?

I can't name one. Except for realtor.

Clearly when your only tool is a hammer everything looks like a nail. If the only REALTORs you meet are inadequate perhaps the quality agents are unwilling to work with clients with perception and attitude issues.

One skill REALTORs develop is an ability to quickly assess the character of the people they represent and negotiate with. A average to good agent would pick up your attitude and quickly conclude, NEXT. The good agents have as many clients as they want. Those potential clients with ignorant, intolerant, critical, dishonest, biased, unreasonable attitudes and perceptions are thrown back. They are not keepers. Eventually these potential clients will find an agent to work with, the ones with little or no experience and who does not know better to avoid those who do not value their service.

We weren't passed on by any Realtor that we spoke to. We just could tell that all four agents were not trustworthy. We also offered within 3 weeks and closed in another 3 weeks after seeing 3 or 4 houses. So any astute agent would have known it would be pretty easy money. We are happy with our purchase, b/c we knew what we wanted. But we were very disappointed with the quality of the Realtors. Maybe next time we will have better luck.

Any advice on finding a good Realtor? Are there Realtor rating services? If some agents are so much better than the others, is there a way to see who got ripped off by whom? The good agents should be raking the bad ones over the coals, huh?

ELC, is there some reason that you think Redfin's data is lacking? Redfin had all of the same properties available through the Realtor's MLS data, and updated data within two hours when our house changed status. What does a Realtor offer that Redfin doesn't?

I am writing this not for those that have such a negative opinion. This response is to inform those who may really care about some facts.

First there is a difference between a REALTOR and a real estate agent. A REALTOR must abide by an oath to follow the Code of Ethics and that holds us to a higher standard meaning we must put our clients first. If that is not the exprlerience you have had then you need to file a complaint with that agents' state licensing body or the association they belong to.

Here is what Realtors ARE responsible for:(note all of these are consumer focused). Again, I am speaking about Realtors NOT licensees :
*REALTORS fought for the the $500,000 capital gains tax exemption when selling your primary residence. For single people $250,000 exemption
*REALTORS have been fighting for a long term extension of flood insurance because Congress keeps using it as a hold out in order.to get other bills signed. Without flood insurance properties that need it cannot close. According to govt numbers that is over 3000 closings per day that will not happen for each day there is a gap in flood insurance. It is currently expired and has a 60 day extension
*REALTORS are fighting to prevent Government from abusing eminent domain so property is not wrongfully taken from property owners to increase tax base
*REALTORS are fighting for responsible lending but NOT requiring 20% down which woud exclude over 70% of those with excellent credit that would otherwise be able to buy a home. This will definitely slow the housing recovery and therefore values recovering.
*REALTORS fight at the local, state and federal level preventing regulations that would put unfair burdens on current homeowners
*REALTORS are fighting with the government about the federally imposed regulations on appraisers that force appraisers.to use foreclosures as comparable even when there are sales to support a sales price. Appraisers are now in the fight along side us
*REALTORS have successfully fought with regulators to remove fees imposed on certain loans that would go towards funding the health care bill
*REALTORS are fighting so credit unions have more ability to fund commercial loans. This would help the commercial market rebound.

These are just a handful of things REALTORS DO having nothing to do with commission. I can tell you many cases where a homeowner thought they could sell on their own, screwed up their own deal to then call for help happy to pay the fee for our service. Same for buyers who don't know what to ask for or how to negotiate. Do some buyers and sellers have success on their own? Absolutely but it is NOT the majority.

Nobody forces anyone to use a REALTOR, it is a choice someone makes. I have known buyers to pay way over what they should have due to inexperience and the excitement of buying a home and I have seen sellers sell WAY too low, again, due to inexperience. Yes, you could argue the fee is high but calculate the cost of screwing up your own deal and I will bet you would be happy to use a professional. Banks require homeowners who wish to short sale their home to use a REALTOR and forbid them to act on their own behalf

RE: What it takes to get a real estate license....as a consumer who would hire a REALTOR you probably want someone who treats their profession as a career and not a part time hobby. That person would have designations and certifications indicating they are constantly interested in learning how to best meet the needs of their clients. There are a lot of REALTORS so ask the right questions instead of hiring a friend or an agent that sells only one or two houses a year.

While I realize I probably won't change the minds of the avid "haters" hopefully some others will now know that we do function outside working to earn a living which I did not think was unusual

CBM says

his response is to inform those who may really care about some facts.

"Facts"? like your "integrity" when NAR released false data every single month of the year for 5 years running? That's a fact and the truth. We know all about your "facts". Your problem is you conflate your "facts" with truth and then pass it off as truth. And of course the public doesn't expect you people to know the difference so I'll explain it to you. A fact allows you to be "right". However, being "right" and the truth are two different things in that you can be "right" irrespective of the truth. And getting to the truth is always a bumpy painful process that you people seem to do anything to avoid.

CBM says

A REALTOR must abide by an oath to follow the Code of Ethics and that holds us to a higher standard

BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

We know all about your voluntary code of ethics.

It's hilarious when someone invokes the "code of ethics" when desperately attempting to defend these shysters.

CBM says

Nobody forces anyone to use a REALTOR

Really? Another lame, worn out excuse by you creeps? And how many times will you continue to mis-use this false assertion? The truth is MLS is a monopoly.

What a seething shitpot of jackasses you people are.

APOCALYPSEFUCK isFrank Sinatra says

The Realtor® point of view is always - 'assholes, it's their fault for believing what they're told and the wife deserved to see her husband blow his brains out in front of her. Better luck next life. Hahahahahahahahaha!'

Exactly.

How many millions of lives have these people destroyed with their antics?

What a joke. Most of you clowns don't know the difference between shit and shineola. I mean really, pull your head out of your ass...what a bunch of under-educated windbags. If you ever want to do your own Real Estate transaction I welcome you...and I hope I'm the agent on the other end. You'd realize the value of an agent in a hurry. Most of you have an attention span of less than three minutes and couldn't negotiate a Real Estate transaction from start to finish if your life depended on it. You know what they say....Oh' wait, you don't know what they say do you.

If you prefer leaving a comment on this post, let it be known it will be for you and you only....as I will NOT be back to this waste of time website anytime soon.
Sincerely,

GoFuckYourself
REALTOR

Because, as one Realtor told me, they like people. That's why they are in the business.

jvolstad says

Because, as one Realtor told me, they like people. That's why they are in the business.

as one realtor told me, they like money. That's why they are in the business.

jvolstad says

Because, as one Realtor told me, they like people. That's why they are in the business.

as another realtor told me, they like money. That's why they are in the business.

EconPete says

The housing market would recover faster if home deals could omit this expensive middle man.

Recover to what ? higher prices, thats not a recovery thats a bubble!
This is now the second correction we have seen over the past 30 years.

Has it sunk in that prices eventual fall and go back to some normality...

Too many people still think prices go up 10-30-50% year over year!
Its just crazy talk to think that ... like we need another nail in the coffin.

I guess you hate everyone because every profession has criminals which is not indicative of an entire profession. Must be hard to harbor such venom for the world. Takes a lot of energy to be this angry.

CBM says

I guess you hate everyone because every profession has criminals which is not indicative of an entire profession. Must be hard to harbor such venom for the world. Takes a lot of energy to be this angry.

Once again with the conflations and false equivalencies? I see a whole lot of truth telling and you call that anger?

The sentiment really is truth then. You guys really are stupid and unethical.

FUCKAPOCALYPSE says

I will NOT be back to this waste of time website anytime soon.

Good riddance jackass.

The national association of realtors bribes politicians more then any other group of privilege buying scumbags, because they are the last line of defense to save American Homeownership for the populace. And the six hour certification course that the whores must take to enter the profession, is proof positive, that these freedom fighters earn every cent of the 40k on the sale of a 700k government subsidized shitbox. What the hell is wrong with you people? You should be giving realtors hand jobs of appreciation rather then sitting here posting all the lies and being filled with negativity. I mean, where would you be without heart surgeons, scientists, and realtors?

FUCKAPOCALYPSE says

I will NOT be back to this waste of time website anytime soon.

If you change your mind,you better come back with a new identity.

Frankly I think your anger is displaced. Why no similar anger towards attorneys or politicians. You know, those "people" who are the real thieving, corrupt, lying, scumbags?

I agree. Recovery will be when home prices decline another 25%. More in some areas. We're looking for at least an 80% decline from peak prices. Then let it fluctuate in line with the land that's slowly appreciating tempered with the improvement on it that's depreciating. Artificially created supply and demand as well as cheap easy financing will only lead to trouble.

IMO a house is a home. It's not an ATM or a get rich quick scheme. Leave speculation to the stock market or the casinos. Laws need to be passed to prevent the greedy from taking advantage of people's desire to have a piece of the American Dream or pretty soon there won't be one.

Honest Abe says

Frankly I think your anger is displaced. Why no similar anger towards attorneys or politicians. You know, those "people" who are the real thieving, corrupt, lying, scumbags?

Frankly, attorneys and medical doctors are considered "professional" and actually know something.

You can stop with the false equivalency that realtors= MD's, JD's and engineers. Realtors are toll booth collectors and nothing more.

taka says

as another realtor told me, they like money. That's why they are in the business.

LOL. They're in the wrong business if they like the money!

http://www.realtor.org/field-guides/field-guide-to-quick-real-estate-statistics

FUCKAPOCALYPSE says

If you prefer leaving a comment on this post, let it be known it will be for you and you only....as I will NOT be back to this waste of time website anytime soon.
Sincerely,

GoFuckYourself
REALTOR

I'd reconsider. Where are you going to find an unmoderated site like this one to play in?

You Lowlife says

Honest Abe says

Frankly I think your anger is displaced. Why no similar anger towards attorneys or politicians. You know, those "people" who are the real thieving, corrupt, lying, scumbags?

Frankly, attorneys and medical doctors are considered "professional" and actually know something.

You can stop with the false equivalency that realtors= MD's, JD's and engineers. Realtors are toll booth collectors and nothing more.

Personally (and I only mean ME) I've been exposed to what I'd referred to as more 'unprofessional' lawyers and doctors than I have Real Estate agents (or, Realtors) in my life. A 7 year degree does not guarantee 'professionalism'.

I've been in sales for 25 years and your analogy of a toll booth operator is one I think of regularly. I have a bridge, it's one of many bridges available to prospective buyers and consumers.

My goal is to make the absolutely best passage available. I'm not the cheapest as I am providing great service, but my bridge is the smoothest, fastest way to get Buyer to Consumer connected. Once passage is easy for Buyer and Consumer to make, they willingly hand over their toll to my company.

Our 'toll' is 20-25%....a whole helluva' lot more than RE Agents charge for their services.

A good Agent is well worth 6%. A bad one could make that same 6% an insufferable amount to pay.

CBM says

I can tell you many cases where a homeowner thought they could sell on their own, screwed up their own deal to then call for help happy to pay the fee for our service.

I've found having a good title company is the key to a smooth deal. In a FSBO the buyer or seller can pick their title company. When a Realtor is involved they usually use a title company that sucks. Why they choose a crummy title company I have no idea. I even had a Realtor willing to walk (and betray their client) because I insisted on using my title company. I gave in and agreed to use theirs. Low and behold when the buyer saw my title company crossed out on the contract he called them directly asking for a price estimate. In the end I ended up accepting an offer from someone easier to deal with but it goes to show you the buyer was open to using my title company, the Realtor wasn't and lost the deal because of it.

With Realtors I've found when they're bad they're VERY bad. When they're good they're very good. As soon as I know I'm dealing with one of the bad ones I take an alternative route if at all possible. What's also worked for me is calling their broker and begin dealing with them. I told him we were having a clash of personality. (resisting the temptation of telling him his agent was a lying egotistical fool) :)

YesYNot says

Any advice on finding a good Realtor? Are there Realtor rating services? If some agents are so much better than the others, is there a way to see who got ripped off by whom? The good agents should be raking the bad ones over the coals, huh?

ELC, is there some reason that you think Redfin's data is lacking? Redfin had all of the same properties available through the Realtor's MLS data, and updated data within two hours when our house changed status. What does a Realtor offer that Redfin doesn't?

To find a good Realtor start out by calling the broker. If you can't get ahold of them move to the next. If you feel a rapport with the broker, tell him/her your needs then ask the broker to recommend an agent or see if they want to handle it. Get the broker's cell number. Then if you have a problem with the agent you have the broker to fall back on.

The MLS has all sorts of information fields you can add that Redfin doesn't have. I can search for sellers that have no balance on their mortgage. Foreign owners. Out of state owners. Lease options. Properties just listed or going back to any date I choose. Properties based on commission rates. Lis Pendens. I can search any key word in the remarks or description sections. And all this can be set up as an automatic notification watch list. Also I can see the complete property history including who sold it, how many times they changed Realtors, price changes. I can see the broker remarks. And more! I list some of the things at http://realtytraining.org

However, most Realtors and Investors don't know how to customize the program to do these things but the ones that hire me learn how.

The doctor who graduated last in his class is still called doctor. Few are better at keeping the least common denominator in the profession than doctors. All occupations have members that range from the brilliant to the incompetent. Those who gripe about paying reasonable fees, get the representative who work for peanuts, and get the service, knowledge and experience that goes with it. As a REALTOR with 33 years experience over 4000+ closed transactions, my clients and I are thankful for all of you chose not to be represented. In the words of the Wolf, "Come closer my child so I might better see you" You are eaten by the party with the better representation. Only the fool chooses not to be represented or refuses to pay for quality representation.

As a REALTOR with 33 years experience over 4000+ closed transactions, my clients and I are thankful for all of you how chose not to be represented or pay convicts 495 to be the your representative in the largest and most complex financial transaction in your life. In the words of the Wolf, "Come closer my child so I might better see you" You are eaten by the party with the better representation. Only the fool chooses not to be represented or refuses to pay for quality representation.

Yes there there seems to be a huge increase in nigerian pastors renting their Bay Area SFR's from Nigeria. We should have invaded that fooking country, Iraq never did nuthin to us.

It is not unethichal to aggressively represent your client which I do with enthusiasm and skill. If that means gutting of those of you too stupid or cheap to hire a professional, it is not bragging it is capitalism. The world is controlled by survival of the fittest. Those of you who think you can do it yourself are destined to be eaten buy those who understand the value of a professional advocate.

Bruce Ailion says

As a REALTOR with 33 years experience over 4000+ closed transactions,

That is great! And I'm willing to pay 6% for good representation because I don't want to waste my own time on back and forth during the negotiation process.
Just don't compare Realtors to doctors and attorneys and make it an argument for earning your commission. Actually, I found a few accountants and finance majors who are Realtors. They either treat that as a part-time work or just realize that it is easier work for better money.
It is what it is, easy job for easy money. You have to know how to bulshit people and who is naive enough to be bulshitted to. Do not make up the whole ideology of something so simple just to justify it.

If it was that profitable and easy 90 percent would not leave the field in the first 5 years. I make more as a REALTOR than I could as an attorney. As an attorney it is easy to out negotiate the average REALTOR still I work with REALTORS with only a high school diploma that do an outstanding job representing their clients. The savvy consumer can hire the best for essentially the same price as hiring the worst. To the uninformed it looks simple. To the top performers it is simple for them.

Every try installing a garage door opener. You can spend 8 hours and perhaps get it done or hire the expert who does 4-5 installations a day and does in in 45 minutes and gets it right the first time.

Bruce Ailion says

If it was that profitable and easy 90 percent would not leave the field in the first 5 years. I make more as a REALTOR than I could as an attorney. As an attorney it is easy to out negotiate the average REALTOR still I work with REALTORS with only a high school diploma that do an outstanding job representing their clients. The savvy consumer can hire the best for essentially the same price as hiring the worst. To the uninformed it looks simple. To the top performers it is simple for them.

Every try installing a garage door opener. You can spend 8 hours and perhaps get it done or hire the expert who does 4-5 installations a day and does in in 45 minutes and gets it right the first time.

Why do we hire professionals in the first place?

1. Either we cannot handle something ourselves (not enough knowledge or skills)

2. Or we could handle it ourselves but our time is more valuable (it costs us less to use someone's services than to do it by ourselves.

If, like people claim here, we have to hire someone because there is the control of the information or market and we see an abuse because of that then no wonder people are upset.

The key issue here is we need to have these choices.

There were some days in my life I prefered to do some house work myself than hire 'a professional'. I might like the process of learning how to correctly install the garage door or simply I need to save some money.

My 8 hours of work would produce this same outcome, fixed garage door plus some money stay in my pocket.

In the Real Estate business you are telling me that "good luck" you are going to be eaten by 'professionals'. What choices do I have?

How many Realtor's would it take to install a garage door opener?

Somehow, I think that
one would start a national association of garage door opener installers,
one would lobby congress to make it illegal for home owners to install garage doors,
one would get insurance,
one would hire a broker to the correct bank to finance the garage door,
one would hire a lawyer to try to prevent other garage door installation prices from being listed on non approved web sites,
ninety seven would try to install a garage door, fail, and go work at McDonalds,
two would patrol web sites telling home owners that they will fail miserably if they try to install a garage door,
and one would install the door.

I'm thinking about 105 should cover it.

GraooGra says

If, like people claim here, we have to hire someone because there is the control of the information or market and we see an abuse because of that then no wonder people are upset.

I've met many people who got licensed just so they could have the inside track and save some commission buying and selling their home. It's not that hard or expensive to get licensed. If someone is bellyaching about "control of information" it means they don't have the patience, literacy level, or the minor commitment it takes to get licensed. Heck, you can even do the school online.

If Realtors are so dumb and incompetent just imagine those in this business who don't even have what it takes to make it to the "inside." If you can't beat 'em, join 'em. If you can't join 'em, hate 'em? Is that the path to success?