patrick.net

The Original Bankster says

Hmm, you must be only in the east bay and never venture out??

Profit is the greatest good.

thunderlips11 says

Why is California thirsty? Because it's semi-arid terrain is not suitable for growing most of the crops it grows.

Sounds like a liberal's solution, just get rid of one of the most productive agriculture areas in the country.

indigenous says

Sounds like a liberal's solution, just get rid of one of the most productive agriculture areas in the country.

Get rid of the massive government-paid infrastructure for irrigation, and it's not terribly productive at all for many crops.

Eastern State corn requires no massive irrigation. We're certainly not low on corn, given that we use more than a third of it for ethanol bullshit.

thunderlips11 says

Get rid of the massive government-paid infrastructure for irrigation, and it's not terribly productive at all for many crops.

That must be your inner conservative talking? Yup the farm bureau needs some pruning.

Check out http://weekendsherpa.com/ and then tell me CA sucks. Not for hikers, it doesn't. I hiked yesterday in cool weather, I'm hiking in 10 minutes and I'll be doing 11 miles from redwoods to the ocean next week. I can hike every day if I want, but I'm not an animal ;p.

thunderlips11 says

Get rid of the massive government-paid infrastructure for irrigation, and it's not terribly productive at all for many crops.

BTW, this isn't a plea to end all irrigation in California. I'm just pointing out that massive taxpayer paid infrastructure is necessary for the high output of CA ag.

thunderlips11 says

massive taxpayer paid infrastructure is necessary

Necessary or a political reality?

Greenwater = Rainfall
Groundwater = Aquifer
Surfacewater = Irrigation

thunderlips11 says

But this is an aside.

I think the reason right-wingers hate California so is the big investment in R&D, Education, and Future Technology that makes it so vibrant and without peer.

They'd rather a Mississippi Style California with people picking lettuce for $2/hr and being charged 25 cents to drink each glass of privatized water.

Sir,

Most of the great R&D industrialists, and even those inventing in CA were Republican. Of course it goes without saying that during the Republican leaning days of California, the amount of R&D and manufacturing was concieved in the US and made in the US. HP and countless others invented much of the base of the technology in a place now called "Silicon Valley".

Hewlett
Packard
Henry Ford
Howard Hughes
William Schottkly
McDonnel
Douglas
Sikorsky
Boeing

Entitlemented says

McDonnel
Douglas
Sikorsky
Boeing

Hmmm.... these names bring to mind a certain activity that the government has a monopoly on.

Kooky Ford I leave for another time; the rest I know little about.

lostand confused says

In terms of scenery, variety, nothing can beat CA

Actually, except for the desert, Maryland probably has all of the scenery that CA has AND when you go to the beach you can actually go into the water here because it's not too fucking cold like it is in CA.

Peter P says

The weather in the Bay Area is unmatched by any place in the world.

Too fucking cold there in the summer.

zzyzzx says

Maryland probably has all of the scenery that CA has

having lived in Hunt Valley for a summer, No.

But point taken about the California Current. Haven't been in the water here for over 20 years, and I only did that dive because i had to.

But I'll deduct half a point since getting to the ocean from Baltimore is a real PITA.

zzyzzx says

lostand confused says

In terms of scenery, variety, nothing can beat CA

Actually, except for the desert, Maryland probably has all of the scenery that CA has AND when you go to the beach you can actually go into the water here because it's not too fucking cold like it is in CA.

Nah been in Maryland. Nice place, but nowhere near to CA in terms of variety. I wonder if you have been to CA?? Los Angeles on south, you can get into the water for about 5-6 months a year. It ain't FL, but you can and I would assume northeast would be the same-I doubt above Virginia, you can get in in the fall and winter??? Just a few photos, plenty more terrain , variety and landscape. One can love the place/terrain and not like the politics, locals etc.

bristle cone pine trees-many are almost twice as old as jesus -some over 5,000 years old.

lostand confused says

In terms of scenery, variety, nothing can beat CA

Disagree. CA is a big hype. I find the SFBA quite run down and depressing actually.

gsr says

lostand confused says

In terms of scenery, variety, nothing can beat CA

Disagree. CA is a big hype. I find the SFBA quite run down and depressing actually.

It depends-if you hung out in the urban areas mostly-possibly. I spent my time hiking, river rafting, horseback riding, camping , paragliding all over CA. Its probably why I didn't have much savings back then and didn't buy a house! I still do and so do see the terrain outside. I do love north/south AZ, UT, CO, SD and Idaho. But the Midwest, while I love it, miss the variety.

lostand confused says

Nah been in Maryland. Nice place, but nowhere near to CA in terms of variety

I don't intend to make it a pissing match. It seems you have been hardly outside CA. The scenic beauty is actually the best in the North West. All you need to do is a Google search. I have been to all of those places in CA, but they did not compare with those in North West IMO.

lostand confused says

I spent my time hiking, river rafting, horseback riding, camping , paragliding all over CA.

Yup, you can do all that as well, including skiing within 30 minutes of driving distance :).

Bellingham Bill says

But I'll deduct half a point since getting to the ocean from Baltimore is a real PITA.

I can ride my bike to Sandy Point (30 miles each way) or North Point state park (~20 miles each way) and go into the even warmer Chesapeake Bay waters, or just hop a bus to Atlantic City like I did on Thursday.. Ocean City MD isn't the closest ocean beach either. People in DC and Baltimore are somewhat brainwashed into going to Ocean City, MD, but I don't see the appeal.

gsr says

lostand confused says

Nah been in Maryland. Nice place, but nowhere near to CA in terms of variety

I don't intend to make it a pissing match. It seems you have been hardly outside CA. The scenic beauty is actually the best in the North West. All you need to do is a Google search. I have been to all of those places in CA, but they did not compare with those in North West IMO.

Which part of the northwest. I have been to OR multiple times and WA. Didn't like Seattle, but loved the terrain a lot once you hit east in WA towards Idaho.

I have been to 36 states and many countries, no pissing match-but my major passion -travelling and enjoying everything. each person likes his own, but I did not see anything up there as spectacular as Yosemite. Now Utah has some spectacular scenery-very underrated when compared to the grand canyon. But never figured why CA elicits so much hatred. If you are talking about the extreme left loonies-I actually agree-but why that has to transfer to nature beats me. The only thing I found close to the CA coastline was Cape town, south Africa-beautiful place and hmm reminds me of a beautiful honey I met there :).

lostand confused says

Didn't like Seattle, but loved the terrain a lot once you hit east in WA towards Idaho.

The city of Seattle is just a cleaner version of San Francisco. Here is a small list of places "http://northwestfront.org/media/northwest-scenery/".

It does not include a large number of state parks close to Seattle Metro area, where you can go any time within an hour of driving

In addition, you can definitely cross over the border and check out the "beautiful" BC.

Peter P says

The weather in the Bay Area is unmatched by any place in the world.

especially if you like cold, windy beaches

gsr says

lostand confused says

Didn't like Seattle, but loved the terrain a lot once you hit east in WA towards Idaho.

The city of Seattle is just a cleaner version of San Francisco. Here is a small list of places "http://northwestfront.org/media/northwest-scenery/".

It does not include a large number of state parks close to Seattle Metro area, where you can go any time within an hour of driving

In addition, you can definitely cross over the border and check out the "beautiful" BC.

Easier to get to decent skiing than the horrible slog up 80 to Tahoe from the Bay Area.

People from Texas will tell you Texas is the best state for scenery/variety/outdoors activity. You know, mountains and desert in the west, beaches in the southeast, forests in the east. (let's just agree to not talk about the pan handle)

People from the Appalachians, Ozarks, Rockies and Adirondacks will tell you they have the most beautiful wilderness They lack a coastline, though.

California is pretty awesome in this regard, but so are the rest. I found the PNW to be gorgeous - and if you like the weather who's to say it's not better than California? Maine is awfully beautiful, too...And Nova Scotia. And Norway...and....

swebb says

People from Texas will tell you Texas is the best state for
scenery/variety/outdoors activity. You know, mountains and desert in the west,
beaches in the southeast, forests in the east. (let's just agree to not talk
about the pan handle)

People from the Appalachians, Ozarks, Rockies and Adirondacks will tell you
they have the most beautiful wilderness They lack a coastline, though.

I use to go the Dallas for client work. Basically flat ass land north, south, east and west. unless you mean driving across the damn state which may take eight hours.

With respect to the weather, let's put it this way if I want warm and sunny, I drive half hour east or south and it is sunny and warm all the time. If it is 100 degree oven weather in Livermore, I am 80 degree degree in San Francisco. If I still feel hot, I head to ocean beach and it is 65 degree. It won't be 105 in Phoenix and 101 in Sedona and 103 in Scottsdale.

What is more comfortable than biking across golden gate bridge in 65 degree weather in the dead of summer? If you want 20 degrees more, drive half an hour out and get on your shorts and sandals.

If you drive 101 through Marin, it is tree lined hillside home on one side and the bay on the other side, one mile across from mountain to Bay. Across the mountain is the ocean, beach and Mt Tam park.

Peter P says

The weather in the Bay Area is unmatched by any place in the world.

You haven't been to New Zealand then. The bay of plenty, hawkes bay, and gisborne regions have the best weather anywhere.

Peter P says

The weather in the Bay Area is unmatched by any place in the world.

Yeah, can't beat that fog - truly unmatched in the world. Geez, get out of your bubble and live in other parts of the country.

bob2356 says

Peter P says

The weather in the Bay Area is unmatched by any place in the world.

You haven't been to New Zealand then. The bay of plenty, hawkes bay, and gisborne regions have the best weather anywhere.

That is the one continent I have yet to set foot on. Would love to visit NZ and Australia. New Zealand is supposed to have a very wide variety of terrain too? Argentina is pretty cool too-but it is a big country , so expected.

Weather wise, not a big fan of the bay area or the northwest. There is an imaginary spot just around Santa Barbara or a bit north of there where the coast becomes windy and chilly. South of there is mighty fine. But can't beat San Diego or coastal LA weather. I liked the hills of Malibu and Ventura county the best-close the coast,yet up in the hills and a varied weather pattern. The coast is somewhat tempered throughout. Big Bear is nice and so are the mountains north of LA through which I5 passes. You can be in the beach and if traffic permits in about a bit more than an hour will be up 4,000 ft driving 70-80 mph.

395 is my favorite road in CA, camped multiple times. Nothing like pulling your car off road and camping overlooking a lake surrounded by snow capped mountains and waking up to that in the morning and having a hot coffee. Mmm.. That is what I miss here in the Midwest-the variety. But I do make a ton of savings, a nice job, much less competition than CA, low housing costs and not as many far left or far right loonies.

But those are two different things and I must admit am surprised when people mix up the two. Housing is extreme and far too left wing for my tastes. But really appreciate my youth spent there-perfect place to spend your youth , beautiful nature and great partying-what can beat that! Although when I retire, I might be looking at other places or even countries -lets see.

mmmarvel says

Peter P says

The weather in the Bay Area is unmatched by any place in the world.

Yeah, can't beat that fog - truly unmatched in the world. Geez, get out of your bubble and live in other parts of the country.

To me perfect weather means 45F - 70F year-round. Overcast is even better. I like it cool and dry in the shade.

mmmarvel says

Peter P says

The weather in the Bay Area is unmatched by any place in the world.

Yeah, can't beat that fog - truly unmatched in the world. Geez, get out of your bubble and live in other parts of the country.

SF fog can link up with Tule fog:

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tule_fog

Tule fog is about as bad as it gets.

bob2356 says

Peter P says

The weather in the Bay Area is unmatched by any place in the world.

You haven't been to New Zealand then. The bay of plenty, hawkes bay, and gisborne regions have the best weather anywhere.

I have been to NZ and I liked it too. IIRC it is drier here. Humidity bothers me.

mmmarvel says

Yeah, can't beat that fog - truly unmatched in the world. Geez, get out of your bubble and live in other parts of the country.

the women look better when it's foggy