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tatupu70
2011 Aug 20, 5:34am
I don't follow. How were you damaged? Your realtor told you the offer was too low. The house subsequently went on the MLS and other buyer put in an offer presumably higher than yours. The house sold.
Unless the sales price is less than your offer, how were you damaged?
I'm with Tatu on this. where are the damages? So you basically didn't get this particular house because you didn't offer up as much as someone else that apparently thought it was worth more than you did. Sounds like sour grapes to me. Why didn't you insist that he present the offer even though you were trying to low ball them? You probably would have lost this place to someone else anyway.
justme
2011 Aug 20, 6:24am
The house subsequently went on the MLS and other buyer put in an offer presumably higher than yours.
What if the other offer was $1 higher. Would it be A-ok then to ignore your first client? I think NOT.
The problem here is not that the amount may have been higher, but that the agent did not even attempt to submit the bid that he was asked to submit.
The agent left his client out of the game entirely. The client did not even get a chance. That's the problem.
What are the rules regulating multiple agency when an agent has multiple clients that are all buyers?
tatupu70
2011 Aug 20, 6:36am
The house subsequently went on the MLS and other buyer put in an offer presumably higher than yours.
What if the other offer was $1 higher. Would it be A-ok then to ignore your own client? I think NOT.
The problem here is not that the amount may have been higher, but that the agent did not even attempt to submit the bid that he was asked to submit.
The agent left his client out of the game entirely. The client did not even get a chance. That's the problem.
What are the rules regulating multiple agency when an agent has multiple clients that are all buyers?
Maybe--It's hard to tell if realtor was giving advice to his "buddy" or if he actually refused to put the offer in.
Even so, the OP can report the agent to the NAR and maybe get him fired, but I don't see how he could sue for damages.
Thanks for the support.
For those asking what damages, let me break this down for you.
Realtor was not my buddy. Realtor was someone my buddy had previosly used.
The damage is fiduciary duty. I was his client on this house, he was representing me. He should not have made an offer on the house with another person while he was representing me on it. I was damaged because I didn't get a chance on the house.
What if after my realtor submitted the offer, I went directly to the listing agent and said, you know what? If you take this offer, I'll cut my realtor out and work directly with you? Would my realtor have suffered damages? Same shit.
To all those who assumed low-ball offer, did you fail reading comprehension? Where did I say low-ball? I said it was overpriced by 10 percent but that I made
a reasonable offer. I made an offer that was higher than the avg of all the
comps this realtor provided.
Again, for those with reading comprehension problems, I don't care if I would've lost the house anyway, it's the unethical behavior by this realtor whore that really bugs.
tatupu70
2011 Aug 20, 7:44am
The damage is fiduciary duty. I was his client on this house, he was representing me. He should not have made an offer on the house with another person while he was representing me on it. I was damaged because I didn't get a chance on the house.
Sure you did. Go find another realtor as soon as he said he wouldn't submit your offer. What exactly are your damages though? How did his (in)action cause you any financial penalties?
Others can speak to fiduciary duty. If a realtor has multiple clients that all want the same house, I would think he can submit offers from all clients. He just can't disclose any inside information to them about the his other bids.
Not submitting your bid is a problem, though. Did he refuse or just suggest you bid higher?
tatupu70
2011 Aug 20, 7:46am
What if after my realtor submitted the offer, I went directly to the listing agent and said, you know what? If you take this offer, I'll cut my realtor out and work directly with you? Would my realtor have suffered damages? Same shit.
I forgot to address this. It's not the same shit. The realtors damages are obvious--his lost commission. What are your damages??
propmgrjay
2011 Aug 21, 4:08am
Based only on what you've written, it sounds illegal. Maybe you'll want to contact the local association of realtors. They're usually pretty good at dealing with ethical violations.
B.A.C.A.H.
2011 Aug 21, 4:24am
This is just yet another anecdote.
Anecdote by anecdote, bit by bit, one pissed off "customer" at a time, the Realtor® Entity is creating a situation to make itself irrelevant.
Like land line phones. Like cable TV.
Done!
2011 Aug 21, 5:40am
a great house and 'only' about 10 percent over-priced.
That was the first thing wrong with this story.
Robber Baron Elite Scum
2011 Aug 21, 9:13pm
It's a sad world we live in when you can't trust anybody.
Very true. The real estate industry today has become a den full of vipers, thieves and liars.
Although their are still honest people in this industry - the corruption is too much on so many levels.
But than again... This type of corruption is a problem in so many other industries.
Greed is going to destroy the prosperity on earth.
elliemae
2011 Aug 21, 11:13pm
He hired the realtor to do a job for him - by signing the contract he agreed to use the realtor & pay him while the realtor agreed to represent his interests in the transaction.
The realtor screwed him - he wasn't representing his interests if he represented someone else's. And he's probably banking on this guy not understanding that concept.
Not only does he have the contract they drew up, but he also was referred to a mortgage company by the realwhore.
His damages will be determined by the court, not by patnet readers. And the realwhore's broker might be interested in hearing about this (unless he is the broker). The RE board might be interested in this breach of ethics.
Small claims court judgement means nothing. Court has no authority to collect the money. It is up to the winning plaintiff.
Well, it's not criminal. Where would you suggest he sue?
And how much you gonna charge the client to collect $2000 judgement? No win situation for plaintiff in this case. I don't expect judge to give a several thousand $ judgement.
You'd be surprised - he'd probably get the $ plus greatly inconvenience the realwhore - and it'd make the papers so it would fuck with what little "good" reputation the guy might have.
How did you find out it was pending with your agent? Offer details shouldn't be up for discussion until the deal is closed. Attempting to submit anything below the asking price before gets on the MLS may be low ball regardless of what the comps are. Just a case of buyer/seller disconnect. We'll see who was right and who was wrong later.
Should have worked with the listing agent from the start.
klarek
2011 Aug 21, 11:39pm
I don't follow. How were you damaged? Your realtor told you the offer was too low. The house subsequently went on the MLS and other buyer put in an offer presumably higher than yours. The house sold.
Unless the sales price is less than your offer, how were you damaged?
That's what the realtor SAID. Those things are irrelevant. Fact is that ih8alameda found the house thereby doing most the work that realtors think they're needed to do, then said realtor scum found another buyer who, for whatever reason, he wanted to use to get his commission.
Just by RE license/board standards, this is a complete breach of an agents' obligation. They HAVE to submit an offer if you're their client and you're qualified. It's one thing to break this covenant, but it's practically treasonous to do so while using the listing lead from one client for another client's offer.
People sue all the time without specific financial damages. Just playing up the whole "he stole my dream, my future" bit would be good enough to start legal action.
klarek
2011 Aug 21, 11:43pm
Maybe you'll want to contact the local association of realtors. They're usually pretty good at dealing with ethical violations.
Thanks for those who supported my position, and I appreciate those with a different point of view as well.
At the end of the day, the realtor owed me a duty as a professional and hopefully some common courtesy as two human beings. Just because you didn't screw someone out of money doesn't mean you weren't a complete unethical jerk.
All I would've asked for was "hey, I'm sorry, I am going to be representing another buyer on this house." Was that too much to ask?
The silver lining in all this is there really isn't any benefit to having your own agent, so from now on I will go with Redfin or the listing agent directly.
As to how I know, my f'd up realtor called to tell me he put in an offer with another client and it was accepted.
tatupu70
2011 Aug 22, 2:51am
At the end of the day, the realtor owed me a duty as a professional and hopefully some common courtesy as two human beings. Just because you didn't screw someone out of money doesn't mean you weren't a complete unethical jerk.
All I would've asked for was "hey, I'm sorry, I am going to be representing another buyer on this house." Was that too much to ask?
I agree 100% with that sentiment. That was most definitely not too much to ask. That realtor was a complete a-hole.
Obviously the realtor is a POS and acted illegally. Honestly, it's why I only use Redfin agents, I have found them informed, honest, and they simply do what you ask them to do. I recommend you give them a try a few times, I can guarantee this shit would not have happened and they would have gladly submitted your offer exactly as you wanted it.
Talk to a lawyer about any possible legal claims if you think there are any. At minimum, this should be reported to DRE (if this is in California, or the equivalent in another state).
This could be any number of things:
tortious interference
breach of fiduciary duty (assuming realtors have such things)
breach of contract
some sort of fraud or misrepresentation
unfair business practices
this is California, so there may be some additional statutory relief
Maybe you'll want to contact the local association of realtors.
The local association will just protect their own. You need the state department of real estate to take an enforcement action.
klarek
2011 Aug 22, 6:11am
At the end of the day, the realtor owed me a duty as a professional and hopefully some common courtesy as two human beings.
realtors are neither professional nor human beings.
propmgrjay says
Maybe you'll want to contact the local association of realtors.
The local association will just protect their own. You need the state department of real estate to take an enforcement action.
Correct. That's the first place I'd start. Make the guy's life hell by getting the state REB's attention. They still do look out for their own, but they're a thousand times more ethical than the fucking realtor scum organizations.
You are calling this agent your realtor. Nowhere do you state that you signed a Buyer Broker Agreement with him.
It makes a difference in his responsibiity to you. If you signed an agreement, you are his client, he had fiduciary duty you, and he absolutely should be reported to local RA. He's in big trouble.
If you have no written agreement for representation, it will depend on laws in your state. He may have zero responsibility to you. Or the act of writing an offer may give you the same standing as a Buyer Broker Agreement. But the offer was not presented. It may have been thrown in the trash, which means there is no proof it existed.
If you have no written agreement for representation, it will depend on laws in your state. He may have zero responsibility to you.
The OP said:
Realtor comes over Tuesday night, drafts up offer than when we told him the amount, it was not a low-ball, def a reasonable offer, he said it was too low, too soon.
Something was written up. Unclear what without more facts.
At minimum, it could be some sort of fraud, misrepresentation, or tortious interference, regardless of whether there was a written document. These inquiries are fact-sensitive. Anyone trying to be an agent has a higher duty, generally, even if that's under regular agency principles, and not under any fiduciary duty that a realtor might have. Taking one potential client's confidential bid, especially for a house the used house salesman admitted they hadn't seen, and using that information for another client is generally a no-no.
elliemae
2011 Aug 23, 12:42am
I say go ahead and fuck with the realtor. He must be stopped, and you'll get a little $. Unfortunately, you won't have the house you wanted, but a little bird tells me there are a few more houses on the market and you'll find another.
TMAC54
2011 Aug 23, 12:54am
I don't follow. How were you damaged?
Exactly what the judge would ask HOW MUCH MONEY DID YOU LOSE ?
So I went to see an open house last Sunday, it was a great house and 'only' about 10 percent over-priced.
Seller was nice told us not on mls yet, brokers tour would be this past Tuesday and will hit the mls after tues.
I wanted to make an offer, so I contacted a realtor my buddy previously used who I've spoken casually about buying houses with Monday, told him I wanted to make an offer. He didn't know about the house, and said he'd go check it out. In the meantime I got pre-approved for over asking by the broker he sent me to.
Realtor comes over Tuesday night, drafts up offer than when we told him the amount, it was not a low-ball, def a reasonable offer, he said it was too low, too soon.
Two days later, I found out the house is pending with my bastard realtor. He took the listing I introduced him to, broke our fiduciary agreement and hooked another 'long time' client with it. I am not upset it went pending, but I'm disgusted by the realtor. Just needed to rant. Unless someone has a good idea how I should sue him for my referral fee for introducing him the house lol.
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