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Got a great deal. Now we get to deal with conractors


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2013 May 24, 4:32pm   2,542 views  8 comments

by Klondike   ➕follow (0)   💰tip   ignore  

Long time lurker here....
*begin ass kissing*

Patrick.net has been a great resource. Thank you all ( bears and bulls alike ).

Even though this site is focused mostly on the west coast and I am outside the city of Philadelphia, the views expressed here have been instrumental in my first property purchase.

*end ass kissing*

I was able to purchase an REO at a very good price with a great rate at the end of April 2013. It needs structural work, but nothing the inspector didn't warn me about.

I thought I was prepared for this purchase thanks to this site (among others) only to find out there is a ton of useful information absent from many housing blogs ( including here ) when it comes to dealing with contractors. Keep in mind, I am not a flipper; they can take me out of this house feet first when the time comes for all I care.

If there is a thread or two here about dealing with contractors, I'm all ears.

Ever hear about "lien waivers", "draw delays" and "liquidated damages "?

I did my due diligence when choosing my contractor, but that didn't stop him from doing the minimum and then asking for 3k more after 3 weeks. This is a 200 year old house and I had that money ready to throw at unexpected crap ( I have more and he will never know that because he hasn't done shit ).

There is a third of an acre on this property and it is lush to say the least, so I have been working my ass off landscaping while watching a dumpster being delivered, some wood and tar paper being dropped off and a trench dug and that is all despite a 4k deposit. I was so pissed over these practices - even more so than I was with the NAR and bank folks I dealt with during the property purchase - that I took the time to educate myself regarding where the contract with this "reputable" guy had failed.

Now that he wants more money (which I am ok'ing - god help me), I am insisting on a new contract including complete itemization of work by date and lien waivers that allow for draw delays as well as liquidated damages. I will be filing the contract with my local Office of the Prothonotary.

Does anyone here have experience with this kind of thing? Any advice regarding step 2..."I bought a money pit and contractors blow, now what?"
Besides shooting myself in the head that is...

#housing

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1   JodyChunder   2013 May 24, 5:29pm  

Klondike says

Any advice regarding step 2..."I bought a money pit and contractors blow, now what?"

Besides shooting myself in the head that is...

Save the suicidal desperation for your first couple of divorces and/or your first cancer scare. Fixing up a dog of a house is nothing to lose sleep over.

My suggestion is to fire the first goldbricker, hop on Angie's List and hire a new contractor. Buying a few illustrated guides to basic home maintenance and repair is my most hearty suggestion, though. Learn how to fix that fucker yourself. It really isn't that complicated to do basic or even intermediate level repairs, and it's actually a lot of fun. In fact, maybe enroll for a course at your local community college if they have anything. The plus side to that is that you'll meet some like-minded gimpers who can swing a hammer.

2   Klondike   2013 May 24, 5:35pm  

I like this idea but, how can I fire him and get my 4k back without a breach of contract on his part? I admit that I should not have signed the original contract without all the bullshit I subsequently discovered was necessary because people suck ( liquidated damages ).

EDIT: I expect to do a shit ton of work on this place but this repair involves two sill plates and jacking a post & beam house up 10" - not exactly DIY.

3   JodyChunder   2013 May 24, 5:48pm  

Yep, contract law is a regular bitch. Next time maybe look online for a boilerplate contract with some basic provisions built-in for your next contractor to look over and sign. Have it notarized or at least witnessed.

You're probably out the 4 large if you fire this turkey; but if it makes you feel any better, even if you'd had a contract drafted with specific clauses built in to safeguard against this kind of thing, it's no guarantee you'd ever see a dime -- or if you did, it'd likely take up a lot of your time and energy. That's because proving something like liquidated damages in most states is a three or four step process to prove that you were not a party in any way to the delays, etc.

Klondike says

EDIT: I expect to do a shit ton of work on this place but this repair involves two sill plates and jacking a post & beam house up 10" - not exactly DIY.

You could do it. If I lived next door, was bored enough, and at least fifteen years younger, I'd help you knock it out.

4   Klondike   2013 May 24, 5:53pm  

My brother is an architect and he actually liked what this guy wants to add on so I am not ready to fire him yet despite the tardiness. That still leaves me with wondering how I can protect myself properly in the new contract. I just want to be happy, the house to be happy, and him and his subcontractors and suppliers to be paid so we can all go have a sandwich. Why is this so hard?

5   bob2356   2013 May 24, 6:17pm  

Standard most places is 10% up front with payments on progress as agreed upon by contract. Always get 3 quotes and compare them. Get references and physically go look at previous jobs. Check their insurance, this is very important. Asking for big bucks up front is usually a sign they don't have credit enough to buy materials. Don't deal with anyone that has that problem. Getting your 4k back if work to date is paid for shouldn't be a problem, but might require a letter from a lawyer.

Sill repair on a post and beam house isn't a biggie for people who know what they are doing. Why the 10" lift? Try calling house movers who specialize in working with really old houses for a referral to someone who is competent at doing this kind of thing. Check out dziuba movers (dbmovers.com) in millertown. They lifted a big 200 year old barn (really, really big barn) for a buddy when I was in Scranton and certainly knew their stuff.

6   Klondike   2013 May 24, 6:40pm  

For the contractor I used, license good, insurance good. http://hicsearch.attorneygeneral.gov/ came back cool.

Thanks for the link! They are far away but worth a shot.
The 10" lift is because the foundation sill was an 8" beam which is completely rotted away in places and the house has fallen 2" or more past that (over the foundation) over the last 200 years where the foundation sill rotted. There is a 2nd floor sill that needs to be replaced as well. The additional 3k is for a cement wall and a z-plate under the old part of the house in the back which is 41 linear feet. My brother liked this because there are 4 layers of siding there as well as river rock nogging from 1807 when it was built in the wall (so it is heavy). I would imagine the nogging would be removed during repair though.
The foundation is cherry or I would have walked.

7   Klondike   2013 May 24, 7:32pm  

So, there is no way to really protect yourself in these contracts?

8   David Losh   2013 May 25, 1:40am  

Klondike says

So, there is no way to really protect yourself in these contracts?

No, you'll never think of everything for a contract, and it is all up to a judge about who was the most reasonable.

The boiler plate is best with certain performance goals, when they should happen, and an accounting of time, and materials.

So far it doesn't sound bad, if the house is jacked up 10' that cost runs about $5K, the repair work could easily be another $5K to $10K to get it enclosed.

What I personally do is hire casual labor to demolish, or uncover as much as I can, as much as I am comfortable with, which can be a lot, before I ask for bids.

The house mover is a good bet. They don't care if they lift 2' or 10' then come back when you are ready to set the structure.

It looks really scary, but it is really pretty simple.

I hate when contractors start talking like they are some sort of gift to you. It's really pretty simple, but everything is in the execution. If it doesn't look, or feel right, you can fire contractor, contract, or no contract.

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