patrick.net

"The estimated $6 billion in extra revenue annually from Proposition 30 quickly would put the state on track to return to peak spending levels before the Great Recession."

This isnt the first nor will it be the last push to raise revenue to spend on education.

Dealing with a thousands of druggies/junkies would have been easier.

Hand over you wallets once again folks!

Does anyone really think California should be spending as much on education as it did in 2007 ? Seriously ?

Back then, what California spent was 23rd highest in the country per student. Now what we spend places us as the 35th highest state in spending per student. Soon, if prop 30 doesn't go through, we probably have to shorten the school year, while class sizes are already huge, teachers have been cut and have taken pay cuts since 2008.

It all sounds like someone elses problem to me. Increasing taxes on the rich and a tiny increase in sales tax is a waste. We all know that it probably all goes right in to the pockets of those union bosses.

I have the idea it's the pensions. let pension payouts float with the market.

Its easy to remember...nO on 30, they both end in 0, or is it O?

And remember to save America, vote for the American!!

Melmakian says

Let me guess: You're a member of the CTA. Am I right?

Yes, and UTLA too. But all teachers are in unions and that has little to do with the facts about current spending on education. By the way, some (including my district) claim that california is 47th in per student spending. I grabbed that 35th number from the first web site that gave numbers.

Here are some details from my district which is often in opposition to the unions.

http://budgetrealities.lausd.net/

http://budgetrealities.lausd.net/sites/default/files/082912%20A%20is%20for%20Alligator.pdf

SFace says

Marcus, I really think the sentiment among voters is:

1) Schools do need more money but...
2) State Government needs meaningful reform first.

I don't understand this. Are you saying throw schools, students and teachers under the bus. Maybe do even worse, to get the public to force the govt to chsnge ?

The government is guilty of spending beyond our means, but now the issue is primarily just that the economy hasn't come back enough (yet).

Go here if you can't read details.

http://budgetrealities.lausd.net/sites/default/files/082912%20A%20is%20for%20Alligator.pdf

I think the state already spent the 6 billion in glossy TV ads with adorable teachers and children.

Not exactly what I see in the school districts that I see.

Moonbeam is back on a tax and spend bender for the unions.

I agree with one of the above posters, reform first tax later. And get that idiot controller off the air begging for taxes and put his nose into the waste, graft and corruptions which should be his 24/24 job.

WE can probably agree people want the services, but don't want to pay for them.

Melmakian says

Because it is about RESULTS. When a business I patronize doesn't satisfy me as a customer, it loses my business. Whatever happens to the workers, suppliers for that business, etc. as a result is not my concern nor should it be.

Okay, but how much of your dissatisfaction is based on reality, and how much is based on propaganda and what you would like to believe for selfish reasons ? Sure there are a lot of poor communities, where the schools aren't great, and where most of the student body doesn't want to be there (that is when they do attend).

But as I've quoted many times before:

The annual Gallup poll about education shows that Americans are overwhelmingly dissatisfied with the quality of the nation’s schools, but 77 percent of public school parents award their own child’s public school a grade of A or B, the highest level of approval since the question was first asked in 1985.

http://www.nybooks.com/articles/archives/2010/nov/11/myth-charter-schools/?pagination=false

By the way, the author of that article used to work for GW Bush, and argued for charter schools, before turning 180 degrees as she became better informed.

There's a lot of propaganda out there, and even many elite democrats buy it at this time.

The fact is, inner city schools have always been bad in this country, but public schools in general and on average have always been pretty good.

Very high percentages of students that go to most of the best of the best colleges and universities in this country come from public schools.

This doesn't mean they don't need to improve a lot.

But whether Califonia schools are 35th in per student spending or 47th, I don't see how you can say that the answer is spending less.

Then again humans are selfish and relatively stupid creatures who often manage to believe what they want to believe. Tell me that you went to a public school and it would be the best argument you can make.

SFace says

So my desire for change is more important than the impact of this year school chaos and uncertainty. Business "rightsize" in 6 months. In politics, changes are resisted until the end or until all leverage are gone. My desire for change means I have to vote for leverage.

Can you be specific about this change you want ?

Is prop 13 going to be undone ? Giving us fair property tax rates on businesses ?

SFace says

Transformative change are things like pension cap, increasing retiring age for existing employees more in line with SS and not stop spiking and future hires.

All thse are only about so called unfunded liabilities, not current defict problems or current underspending on education.

I'm for pension reforms too. ALthough as I've argued ( I think with you) in the past, the pension spending is part of the compensation. It's understood (or was) that in certain careers the salary is lower, but the benefits are somewhat higher. MAybe this has a value of 10K per year, ABOVE THE AMOUNT THAT IS ALREADY TAKEN OUT OF TEACHERS SALARIES toward calstrs. It's just part of their compensation. This is not excessive, and saying it need to be lowered to SS levels smacks of envy.

We live in an amazing time, where public workers are begrudged for their pensions they can have after working 30 years, but tax rates on the rich stay at their lowest level in many decades and may go lower.

People are so short sighted and have no idea how this impacts the future.