patrick.net

Very good point. Thanks for expanding on and adding to what I said. I think what you're saying here is very true, and very well explained.

It doesn't account for the rationale behind every "slacker," but this is definitely going on with a lot of Americans.

It's a crappy job without respect because most people know it's a college major people study if they're not very bright, can't do anything else, don't have any drive or desperately want to re-live their high school days.

rootvg says

It's a crappy job without respect because most people know it's a college major people study if they're not very bright, can't do anything else, don't have any drive or desperately want to re-live their high school days.

My first degree was in business, then much later I got a masters degree in Mathematic (yes, I had to do a lot more undergrad Math first). And I would agree, at least partly with that assessment, or I would have long ago, in the sense that I viewed education majors that way too.

But people who get their bachelors in education are usually going to be elementary school teachers. If they are average in intelligence, and love children, and they prepare well, then as adults they probably are well qualified to teach kids age 7 or 10. The skill set is actually unique.

If they don't have the drive to make it big in the corporate world and would rather have a totally different kind of work, working with and helping young children, I'm not sure, but there might be a certain wisdom in that.

I'm just saying, I felt the same way when I was in college. I just couldn't relate to people who didn't have fantasies of being super rich one day. The idiots !

I like your analysis, but in some parts of the country they turn out SO many of these people not because we need them but because (1) the teacher unions are all powerful, (2) it's a relatively easy degree to get and well understood by the blue collars who predominate in those regions, and (3) it's CHEAP to educate a school teacher when it tends to be expensive to educate the engineers, scientists and other professionals we seem to so badly need.

I graduated in a class of 313 in the mid eighties, and I'll bet one quarter of those kids who were college bound ended up with degrees in Education, primarily Elementary Education. They aren't all slow on the uptake but it's very difficult to have a deep conversation with some of those people. My sister is finishing her Masters in Elementary Ed and when we talk I feel like I'm dragging her along. Her husband is a BSME and MSAE (designs aircraft wings) and it's not that way. My wife has a Masters in Poli Sci and it's not that way. When you talk to those people, they move right along and everything clicks. When you talk to the average Ed major, there's a dead look in their eyes. I've seen it over and over.

I just think a lot of them saw high school as the pinnacle of their lives and want to live it over and over.

rootvg says

I just think a lot of them saw high school as the pinnacle of their lives and want to live it over and over.

When I was in high school, people kept telling me "these are the best years of your life." To which I would reply, "you mean it gets worse?"

CL says

Even if that were so, it simply indicates that they do not feel welcome in today's racist GOP. They run to the Dems, at least partly due to the demonizing the GOP does to them.

Mexicans and Guatemalans find more in common than they do with a party that favors discrimination based on hue.

Papers, please.

LOL! East Bay Radicals have alot to offer the rest of the nation... maybe the rest of California and other states will also adopt all the great things that made Oakland the success story it has become today. Immigrants fleeing persecution will find much confront in east bay Oakland. Heaven forbid any immigrant moves elsewhere to find peace and become productive citizens.. like Santa Clara County...

50 years of wonderful progressive diversity state funded programs have made Oakland the Pearl of the Pacific envy of all... GOOD LUCK !!!

http://www.youtube.com/embed/aPwOTqkZvwM

rootvg says

I just think a lot of them saw high school as the pinnacle of their lives and want to live it over and over.

I think your assessment of education majors is over stated, partly what you perceive as lack of intelligence might be just radically different interests. When I can't relate well to someone, I don't always jump to the conclusion that they're stupid. In your case maybe it's just that they don't like you, or think you're arrogant (no offense). You are pretty right wing. Most teachers are going to be liberal.

Some people don't like arguing even when they see holes in your thinking. Tell me is your sister by any chance a liberal ? Does she by any chance not like to argue with you ?

Most or at least many high school teachers where I'm at did not major in education. Many majored in the subject they teach. I do think it's true that some teachers think of high school as a great time of their life. I didn't become a teacher until I was in my 40s, and wouldn't have thought of it when in my 20s. Adolescence was too much a recent memory. In fact, I sort of view my twenties as a latter stage of adolescence.

In any case, I know what you mean, that it's an unique person that wants to be working back in high school when they are only 5 or 6 years out of high school.

Back to your sister. I've got news for you. She is probably way smarter than you give her credit for. The very fact that you look down on her intelligence tells me a lot.

Speaking of which, I think I used to be sexist in the sense that I sort assumed an edge in certain kinds of intelligence for men, versus women.

Now that I've been teaching for many years, I've reversed my thinking on this (and I teach Mathematics). Now the way I see it is there is no difference in actual aptitude, but women generally do a little better because on average they are more disciplined, have better habits and are less distracted by certain things than men. Some of the very most exceptional Math students I have come across have been girls.

Next time you see your sister get that blank look, ask yourself, did she just stop listening because she thinks I'm an arrogant prick? That would be quite natural if she picks up on your perception of her being less intelligent than you.

thomas.wong1986 says

LOL! East Bay Radicals have alot to offer the rest of the nation...

WTF difference does your assertion make? The point is the problems that the GOP has, that the GOP leaders even recognize that it has.

You are the only one (well, and Captain S) that think the voting patterns don't harm the GOP.

Minorities know the GOP is a den of vipers who trade them as payment to an angry white mob.

We need more money for schools and children - we can't find a way to fund our pensions, and we are not willing to fix pension spiking.