patrick.net

The division is over deportation of illegal aliens .. the reality is deporting back non-US citizens of foreign nations shouldnt be an issue. They are called illegal aliens because they entered the US without authorization and are subjects (citizens) of a foreign government. They are not subjects and jurisdiction of the US.

The terms hispanic and/or latino are about as bigoted as they get. Only PC tyrants and unics with no social interaction use those bigoted labels

Put a Spaniard, Mexican, Puerto Rican, Chilean, and a Cuban together and let them know you just how offensive they find it to be confused as one in the same. Its not that they don't get along, however most grew up being proud of their heritage, and lumping them together as if they are all similar because they speak similar variances of "Spanish" is the height of American ignorance

errc says

The terms hispanic and/or latino are about as bigoted as they get. Only PC tyrants and unics with no social interaction use those bigoted labels

Put a Spaniard, Mexican, Puerto Rican, Chilean, and a Cuban together and let them know you just how offensive they find it to be confused as one in the same. Its not that they don't get along, however most grew up being proud of their heritage, and lumping them together as if they are all similar because they speak similar variances of "Spanish" is the height of American ignorance

That doesn't matter for Demographics. Each Demographic may have different reasons for voting for the Democrats, yet they all do (except Cubans, and that is moving towards the Dems).

And, I've spoken to lots of Latinos of various flavors and have never encountered any who were offended by the term. Maybe they should be, or maybe it's a result of our Euro-centric structure, but they take no umbrage at their Euro roots. In fact, most of their societies have favored the folks who have more European ancestry.

thomas.wong1986 says

and in reality the return for the votes have been shallow by the Dems Party..

Even if that were so, it simply indicates that they do not feel welcome in today's racist GOP. They run to the Dems, at least partly due to the demonizing the GOP does to them.

Mexicans and Guatemalans find more in common than they do with a party that favors discrimination based on hue.

Papers, please.

marcus says

Kids always want to be different than their parents. It's the nature of the human ego. It's not our fault that there was no way they would come up with rock that could compare to the 70s. (although early to mid 90s saw a little burst with alternative).

It would be very very very interesting, if there was a Religious Cult or even a Christian zealot overtone in Pop music influencing kids from the age 10 to 16. It would very interesting to see the reverse of your average Liberal on your above sentiment. I would bet, a radio wouldn't be allowed with in 300 yards of a school. What separation of religion and all that. I would bet you wouldn't be allowed to play that music in a public park, or any public building for that matter, let alone at homes of these same people that see no problem with Thugs, Criminals, Pimps, Whores, Drug Addicts, and Murderers being the epitome of a "Small town Boy, done good". Just by talkin' shit.

errc says

unics

Are those similar to unicorns?

CaptainShuddup says

It would be very very very interesting, if there was a Religious Cult or even a Christian zealot overtone in Pop music influencing kids from the age 10 to 16.

The reason that there's no "Religious Cult or even a Christian zealot" music on the radio or in car speakers is because there's no market for it, not because of some secret plot by the "liberals" to prevent this music from being on the air. Your conspiracy theory has been debunked.

Yous guys don't have christian radio?? What kind of sin bin do you heathens reside in?

Its merely light rock where the words are always about love and god and all that nonsense.

"Top 40" in general makes me want to gouge my eyes out with a spork. The crap that passes for 'music' these days, is about as much music as the crap that passes as food, is food.

Did you hear that? It was the chart of evolutionary progress thudding on the ground, weeeeee!!! I'm calling a bottom

errc says

Did you hear that? It was the chart of evolutionary progress thudding on the ground, weeeeee!!!

Don't confuse biological evolution with the "evolution" of music, technology, civilization, etc. Very different things!

The word "evolution" is misused in so many areas simply because it sounds "scientific."

The Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution:

The GE Evolution Series Locomovite:

If a word is used in marketing, it's become a buzzword.

marcus says

...The result is actually leaving kids behind, rather than the other way around.

Look up "teaching to the test" if you want to know more.

Here's an example of the kind of thing you'll find.

Thanks Marcus. I didn't want to quote the whole thing.

Do you think students fall behind because they are not encouraged enough by their parents to learn, do you think the system with very low standards has anything to do with it? A combination of these and other factors?

And if you have time, can you asnwer this question as well. Do you think these tests simply highlight just how far behind the curse students really are?

FortWayne says

Do you think students fall behind because they are not encouraged enough by their parents to learn, do you think the system with very low standards has anything to do with it?

One thing you probably don't understand is this was not nearly all students. In this same school we have graduates going to Harvard, Stanford, MIT, and many other great schools. That is, many of our students do very well. Many students aren't in the class I was talking about. Many students in 9th grade are already taking geometry, algebra 2, or Trigonometry. I always have at least ten 10th graders that are already in my Calculus class (a class that many such as yourself never get to).

About half the students gradaute our school and go on to four year college. Another 47% continue school at a junior college.

In many cases students fall behind for the same reasons they did 20 or 40 years ago. Parent and student expectations are a factor.

Standards are high, but students are allowed to move on to the next grade with relatively low grades (as you know, this is nothing new).

There are no simple answers. It's complex. Psychology plays a role too.

I don't judge students, but the fact is, there are also students who are just slower or of below average intelligence. For these students not trying gives them the belief that they are doing poorly because they choose to (not because they couldn't do much better if they really wanted to). Obviously, they always can do much better if they are willing to try.

Or I think often students have no idea how well they could do if they applied themselves, but bad habits (laziness) can run pretty deep by the time students are in high school. It's scary for them to change their entire approach to life, and bad habits are difficult to change.

I know that the current political enviroment says its all about the schools and the teachers. The truth is public education needs to do better, but we are not worse than we were 30 or 50 years ago. PRobably much better.

You might want to consider one day what the objectives of your propaganda providers is. Could it be lower taxes (they don't want to pay for decent public education)? Their kids aren't going to go to public schools.

They think they can get it for less, by making teaching an even lower income job than it already is. Your evil unions aren't guaranteeing us vast riches. Just a decent working living. But I understand your programming. It's not unlike the problems I see with some students who have too many years of intellectual laziness to change.

marcus says

I don't judge students, but the fact is, there are also students who are just slower or of below average intelligence. For these students not trying gives them the belief that they are doing poorly because they choose to (not because they couldn't do much better if they really wanted to). Obviously, they always can do much better if they are willing to try.

I think this is a really profound point. Convincing someone to work hard in order to excel is one thing, but "If you work very hard you'll be mediocre, but that's better than failing" is much harder. Americans don't really respect hard work as much as they claim to; what they respect is winning. And no matter how you slice it, there are only so many people admitted to top schools, and this same dynamic is to some degree reflected in the rest of society. If you have an economy where virtually all of the wealth and perks go to those at the very top and everyone else is just sharing varying degrees of loserhood, isn't this attitude to be expected?

Just a thought.

Yes the "winner take all" mentality is very strong in America. No one ever accused Americans of being civilized.

Very good point. Thanks for expanding on and adding to what I said. I think what you're saying here is very true, and very well explained.

It doesn't account for the rationale behind every "slacker," but this is definitely going on with a lot of Americans.

It's a crappy job without respect because most people know it's a college major people study if they're not very bright, can't do anything else, don't have any drive or desperately want to re-live their high school days.

rootvg says

It's a crappy job without respect because most people know it's a college major people study if they're not very bright, can't do anything else, don't have any drive or desperately want to re-live their high school days.

My first degree was in business, then much later I got a masters degree in Mathematic (yes, I had to do a lot more undergrad Math first). And I would agree, at least partly with that assessment, or I would have long ago, in the sense that I viewed education majors that way too.

But people who get their bachelors in education are usually going to be elementary school teachers. If they are average in intelligence, and love children, and they prepare well, then as adults they probably are well qualified to teach kids age 7 or 10. The skill set is actually unique.

If they don't have the drive to make it big in the corporate world and would rather have a totally different kind of work, working with and helping young children, I'm not sure, but there might be a certain wisdom in that.

I'm just saying, I felt the same way when I was in college. I just couldn't relate to people who didn't have fantasies of being super rich one day. The idiots !

I like your analysis, but in some parts of the country they turn out SO many of these people not because we need them but because (1) the teacher unions are all powerful, (2) it's a relatively easy degree to get and well understood by the blue collars who predominate in those regions, and (3) it's CHEAP to educate a school teacher when it tends to be expensive to educate the engineers, scientists and other professionals we seem to so badly need.

I graduated in a class of 313 in the mid eighties, and I'll bet one quarter of those kids who were college bound ended up with degrees in Education, primarily Elementary Education. They aren't all slow on the uptake but it's very difficult to have a deep conversation with some of those people. My sister is finishing her Masters in Elementary Ed and when we talk I feel like I'm dragging her along. Her husband is a BSME and MSAE (designs aircraft wings) and it's not that way. My wife has a Masters in Poli Sci and it's not that way. When you talk to those people, they move right along and everything clicks. When you talk to the average Ed major, there's a dead look in their eyes. I've seen it over and over.

I just think a lot of them saw high school as the pinnacle of their lives and want to live it over and over.

rootvg says

I just think a lot of them saw high school as the pinnacle of their lives and want to live it over and over.

When I was in high school, people kept telling me "these are the best years of your life." To which I would reply, "you mean it gets worse?"

CL says

Even if that were so, it simply indicates that they do not feel welcome in today's racist GOP. They run to the Dems, at least partly due to the demonizing the GOP does to them.

Mexicans and Guatemalans find more in common than they do with a party that favors discrimination based on hue.

Papers, please.

LOL! East Bay Radicals have alot to offer the rest of the nation... maybe the rest of California and other states will also adopt all the great things that made Oakland the success story it has become today. Immigrants fleeing persecution will find much confront in east bay Oakland. Heaven forbid any immigrant moves elsewhere to find peace and become productive citizens.. like Santa Clara County...

50 years of wonderful progressive diversity state funded programs have made Oakland the Pearl of the Pacific envy of all... GOOD LUCK !!!

http://www.youtube.com/embed/aPwOTqkZvwM

rootvg says

I just think a lot of them saw high school as the pinnacle of their lives and want to live it over and over.

I think your assessment of education majors is over stated, partly what you perceive as lack of intelligence might be just radically different interests. When I can't relate well to someone, I don't always jump to the conclusion that they're stupid. In your case maybe it's just that they don't like you, or think you're arrogant (no offense). You are pretty right wing. Most teachers are going to be liberal.

Some people don't like arguing even when they see holes in your thinking. Tell me is your sister by any chance a liberal ? Does she by any chance not like to argue with you ?

Most or at least many high school teachers where I'm at did not major in education. Many majored in the subject they teach. I do think it's true that some teachers think of high school as a great time of their life. I didn't become a teacher until I was in my 40s, and wouldn't have thought of it when in my 20s. Adolescence was too much a recent memory. In fact, I sort of view my twenties as a latter stage of adolescence.

In any case, I know what you mean, that it's an unique person that wants to be working back in high school when they are only 5 or 6 years out of high school.

Back to your sister. I've got news for you. She is probably way smarter than you give her credit for. The very fact that you look down on her intelligence tells me a lot.

Speaking of which, I think I used to be sexist in the sense that I sort assumed an edge in certain kinds of intelligence for men, versus women.

Now that I've been teaching for many years, I've reversed my thinking on this (and I teach Mathematics). Now the way I see it is there is no difference in actual aptitude, but women generally do a little better because on average they are more disciplined, have better habits and are less distracted by certain things than men. Some of the very most exceptional Math students I have come across have been girls.

Next time you see your sister get that blank look, ask yourself, did she just stop listening because she thinks I'm an arrogant prick? That would be quite natural if she picks up on your perception of her being less intelligent than you.

thomas.wong1986 says

LOL! East Bay Radicals have alot to offer the rest of the nation...

WTF difference does your assertion make? The point is the problems that the GOP has, that the GOP leaders even recognize that it has.

You are the only one (well, and Captain S) that think the voting patterns don't harm the GOP.

Minorities know the GOP is a den of vipers who trade them as payment to an angry white mob.

We need more money for schools and children - we can't find a way to fund our pensions, and we are not willing to fix pension spiking.