patrick.net

GNL says

Is this true? Is there some documented history of this?

@GNL Yes, it's true. Easy to look up.

GNL says

Is this true? Is there some documented history of this?

Arab slaver/pirates terrorized shipping in the Mediterranean for hundreds of years, stealing cargo and selling crew and passengers into slavery. They raided coastal cities in Italy etc. kidnapping entire villages. The numbers over centuries was in the millions.

UkraineIsFucked says

The_Deplorable says

Saying the government is dependent on you is like saying the wolf is dependent on the sheep.

HeadSet says

"Saying the government is dependent on you is like saying the wolf is dependent on the sheep."

Only if you believe that the tail is wagging the dog.

HeadSet says

Saying the government is dependent on you is like saying the wolf is dependent on the sheep.

When people stop paying taxes, the government goes bye-bye pretty damn fast.

UkraineIsFucked says

HeadSet says

Saying the government is dependent on you is like saying the wolf is dependent on the sheep.

When people stop paying taxes, the government goes bye-bye pretty damn fast.

That is like the sheep telling the wolf "I forbid you to eat me." The wolf then helps himself to a few bites. In the same manner, people who refuse to pay taxes get their assets seized and jail time. Even the Amish pay taxes.

HeadSet says

That is like the sheep telling the wolf "I forbid you to eat me." The wolf then helps himself to a few bites. In the same manner, people who refuse to pay taxes get their assets seized and jail time. Even the Amish pay taxes.

Tax revenue receipts are dependent upon monetary velocity.

The more transactions that go on, especially between businesses, the more tax revenue is raised.

This is true for both VAT and corporate income tax.

Income taxes on individuals is likewise the cream on top of that.

Contrast that with property taxes that can only be taxed once per year.

This is why states like California go from having huge revenues one year and collapse in said revenue in the next.

This is why cities are far better tax revenue generators both in total $$$ and per capita $$$ than rural areas, with few exceptions (Permian Basin oil/gas fields or Black Hils gold mines).

Overall monetary velocity has been been falling the past 30 years, btw.

So, this is how people can stop or severely reduce overall taxes to the government. By reducing activity that lead to taxeable transactions. This will require a reduction in the hyperspecialization that our modern economy has become. But tech is developing that will make that possible. Both that and reducing cost of production a lot.

Simple example: Just by cutting down eating from home 50% per month, you are fucking with the government's tax revenue cow. Less revenue for restaurants = less taxes they pay. Employees get hours cut/not hired, so less taxes from them, top. Less sales taxes.

Sure, you are buying more groceries to help make up for SOME of that loss. But if you are saving the net savings - especially in the form of assets that don't get taxed (much) like land or gold, or (later) an eDrexler NanoFab - you are fucking this up.

This is why GDP growth is important. GDP is calculated by transactions. Difference betwen 3% vs 2% annual GDP growth is even a big ass deal.

So when we have localized homesteading of the kind not seen in 100 years, the era of Big Government will truly be fucked.

And that day is coming because of technology. Indeed, most of us will be forced into it.

So yes, the Amish pay taxes. But not as much as they would generate if they bought all their clothes at the store instead of making them themselves, ate at McDonald's instead of cooking for themselves or bought all kinds of shit on Amazon with internet service they would pay for but are not doing.

Wolf starves when the sheep doesn't produce enough lambs, dude.

UkraineIsFucked says

So, this is how people can stop or severely reduce overall taxes to the government. By reducing transactions.

That is like the sheep going on a starvation diet in order to get so skinny the wolf won't eat him.

HeadSet says

That is like the sheep going on a starvation diet in order to get so skinny the wolf won't eat him.

Almost. See above. I think my last edit occurred before you wrote this.

UkraineIsFucked says

But if you are saving the net savings -

They'll just tax your savings.

GNL says

UkraineIsFucked says

But if you are saving the net savings -

They'll just tax your savings.

So? $1 in buying shit generates far more in collective tax revenue than a $1 in savings does. Esp if you buy crypto, gold, stocks or art. Those only get taxed when sold.

UkraineIsFucked says

1 in buying shit generates far more in collective tax revenue than a $1 in savings

What exactly is your point? In order to have savings, one must have income, and income is taxed. Also, the point of making money is to buy stuff. People want income so they can purchase houses, cars, food, books, et al. The purpose of savings is to set aside money so you can buy things in the future, hopefully earning interest or dividends along the way. Burying gold in the back yard that will never be spent does not sound logical.

UkraineIsFucked says

Wolf starves when the sheep doesn't produce enough lambs, dude.

So, your philosophy is everyone should become a childless hobo to starve the government of taxes? That will show 'em!

The government will just print to infinity because it's the people who suffer not the pols. I do not think the government ever will give up an inch when it comes to spending what they want to spend. The $ has to implode or something. Much pain in the future. Fiat, imo, is the lifeblood of evil.

HeadSet says

Also, the point of making money is to buy stuff

Not of you can produce it on your own. Bitch to the Amish.

HeadSet says

order to have savings, one must have income, and income is taxed.

So? I never said otherwise.

UkraineIsFucked says

UkraineIsFucked says

HeadSet says

Also, the point of making money is to buy stuff

Not of you can produce it on your own. Bitch to the Amish.

HeadSet says

order to have savings, one must have income, and income is taxed.

So? I never said otherwise.

Patrick says

Patrick says

@Patrick
This is the guy who took on The View.

https://patrick.net/comment?comment_id=2049198

GNL says

Is this true? Is there some documented history of this?

I'd be shocked that PROVIDED that Sowell said that, it's false. I'd check the authenticity of the quote first.

HeadSet says

Saying the government is dependent on you is like saying the wolf is dependent on the sheep.

It's not a wolf though.

It's easy to overthrow a state, all you need is a population that wants it. It's trivial.

The problem is, convincing people that they are better off with a reformed state. That's why we have so much fucking propaganda, we have "misinformation experts", and censorship - precisely because people ARE realizing it.

All this bullshit is erected to protect the state, not inform the public. Our news is bullshit, 3 major social media sites are captured and will happily censor and push propaganda, and the intelligence agencies have betrayed the country, and the military doesn't serve the country.


original link

The whole purpose of this (current) state is illegitimacy, and constantly propagandizing the public into think it's legitimate, it's unbeatable, and it's insurmountable. Who is happy with the government today? It's WELL under 30%. It's like around 15%.

The reason that division is constantly pushed by our government (racism, transgenderism, left, right, religious, atheist, man, woman, etc) is to prevent unity. They don't want the country united, because with a united nation, the government would be forced to change. Remember when unity was PUSHED by our government, consensus was asked for - NOT demanded? That ended with George W. Bush, "either you're with us or against us", and it's gotten worse ever since.

richwicks says

The problem is, convincing people that they are better off with a reformed state.

History shows that post revolutionary states are pretty fucked up.

Including ours. The period between the end of the Revolutionary War and the establishment of our second constitution was unstable. Post-Revolutionary France couldn't build the guillotines fast enought. Russia had a civil war. So did most of South America & Mexico after kicking out the Spanish.

UkraineIsTotallyFucked says

History shows that post revolutionary states are pretty fucked up.

The United States is a post revolutionary state, that's how it was founded.

You can rightly claim that the French revolution was insane, but ultimately it made a better state.

Russia today is a post revolutionary state.

When it's an authentic revolution, and not caused by external factors (i.e. a coup) quite often you end up with a superior nation although that transition is not easy.

The US should have gone through a MAJOR reformation in the 1990's, and didn't. Instead our government continued to waste money on the useless war machine even after the USSR had collapsed. There was a brief pause, and we had ENORMOUS development during the 1990's. We went from having long distance phone calls for communication to just "the Internet". We got sidelined by 9/11 which was very likely done (or at least allowed) by our own government, and we have squandered resources and development into pointless war to the point that nobody supports any of these wars to the point the media is getting afraid to even report on them.

War will be our undoing, it was for the USSR - they squandered all their resources and manpower on their warmachine as well, until there was a revolt. It's going to happen here as well in time. Our nation will start ANOTHER war, and eventually, we're going to get our asses handed to us. I don't think Russia is going to do this, but if we start shit with Iran, they might. They are formidable military force, and Russia will support them.

“The problem isn't that Johnny can't read. The problem isn't even that Johnny can't think. The problem is that Johnny doesn't know what thinking is; he confuses it with feeling.”

— Thomas Sowell

The_Deplorable says

What happens even more so under communism because central planning.

Sowell is 94 years old.