patrick.net

zzyzzx says

If we already have more strict emissions standards, then why do we need this unfair Paris treaty?

We need to globally tax pollution enough to clean up the pollution. The Paris treaty didn't go nearly far enough.

Ultimately allowing polluters to trash the Earth violates free market principles, shifts the costs of their products to people not buying those products, and causes long-term devastation of the economy.

So, what's the up side of picking a few winners and letting them pollute? That's the worst kind of socialism, privatizing the profits while socializing the costs and doing so very inefficiently.

Tenpoundbass says

He should be made to live there for 3 months without consuming one watt of electricity.

Easily done if he picks the right time of year.

Dan8267 says

We need to globally tax pollution enough to clean up the pollution.

China, India and Russia will tell you to go and fuck yourself if any real tax is imposed on them. What's next? Trade war? Blockade leading to real war?

Straw Man says

China, India and Russia will tell you to go and fuck yourself if any real tax is imposed on them. What's next? Trade war? Blockade leading to real war?

China and India don't want to lose the American market. They would comply.

Besides, even your ridiculous nightmare scenario is far better than extinction, war, or mass death.

Dan8267 says

Besides, even your ridiculous nightmare scenario is far better than extinction, war, or mass death.

Right. Real war (and mass death which comes with it) real soon is "better" than potential war/mass death in some distant future.

Dan8267 says

China and India don't want to lose the American market. They would comply.

If they comply they will lose it anyway. Because their shit won't be able to compete. They might chose the path of two world economies instead: one for "carbon-holy" US/EU and other for "carbon-sinners" a.k.a. rest of the world. How do you persuade them to cut carbon emissions then?

When there's an accord that calls for a 1 child policy through a mix of sticks and carrots, I'll be all for it.

And one that takes in account this Mordor in Mongolia:

http://www.news.com.au/travel/world-travel/asia/baotou-is-the-worlds-biggest-supplier-of-rare-earth-minerals-and-its-hell-on-earth/news-story/371376b9893492cfc77d23744ca12bc5

Right now we're subsidizing it and Elon Musk just Rage Quit because he needs this massive, radioactive pollution to continue for Tesla.

We already have the technology and societal sophistication to stop real Pollution. Reduce population, tax the fuck out of Privately Owned Vehicles.

TwoScoopsMcGee says

tax the fuck out of Privately Owned Vehicles.

... and kiss our economy good-fucking-bye.

We could start by taxing the fuck out of privately owned jets! Bet that would really put a kink in Elon's drawers!

Quigley says

We could start by taxing the fuck out of privately owned jets! Bet that would really put a kink in Elon's drawers!

... and Brin's, and Ellison's, and Buffet's.... wait, Buffet uses jet-sharing program, the fucking cheat. Let's tax the shit out of these too.

Straw Man says

Dan8267 says

Besides, even your ridiculous nightmare scenario is far better than extinction, war, or mass death.

Right. Real war (and mass death which comes with it) real soon is "better" than potential war/mass death in some distant future.

The Pentagon is gravely concerned about climate change triggering wars. I'll take their analysis over your conjectures any day.

Straw Man says

If they comply they will lose it anyway. Because their shit won't be able to compete.

So you are saying that capitalism does not work. OK, I'll concede that.

Dan8267 says

Since climate change is irreversible, we should just seize the assets of polluters and deniers and use them to alleviate the costs of climate change. If they thought it would cost them wealth to stop polluting, what until all their assets are confiscated.

He look at that. Your cult even has a cute little name for those that disagree with it. Scientologists have suppressives, you've got deniers.

Fucking White Male says

He look at that. Your cult even has a cute little name for those that disagree with it. Scientologists have suppressives, you've got deniers.

Sounds exactly what a Holocaust denier would say about the term Holocaust denier.

If you think climate change is a hoax, then your opinions are not to be taken seriously.