patrick.net

Rew says

The fight is authoritarianism backed by corruption versus actual representative democracy. Go deep state! Skewer them.

Exactly right! Trump represents the representative democracy though, while the deep state is authoritarian corruption.

Quigley says

Trump represents the representative democracy though, while the deep state is authoritarian corruption.

And therein lies our core difference: while you see Trump as a champion of Western Democracy and not the most authoritarian leaning leader we have had in well over 50 years, I see him as destroying American and Western institutions, if he can.

Ask yourself if the countries that appear aligning with us now are representative of Democratic principals? Are they Democratic countries at all? Go beyond Russia. Who else is embracing our new authoritarian leader? Who else is Trump embracing himself?

Rew says

No meetings with Russians

Meetings with Russians, but nothing about campaign discussed

Today: Met with Russian Lawyer, claimed she had dirt on Hillary, proved otherwise so we asked her to talk to elected officials, because we couldn't do anything about adoption.

Meeting w a Russian national is NOT "meeting w the russians." This is pure, utter garbage. It's 3rd grader type flawed logic. Just amazing to watch the brainwashing take over.

joeyjojojunior says

The DNC? The Senate investigation is controlled by Republicans. The House investigation is controlled by Republicans. The special counsel was appointed by a Republican and reports to a Republican.

This investigation is 100% driven by Republicans. Dems are bystanders.

You are right. I shouldn't differentiate between the R and D establishment criminals. They are all working together.

CBOEtrader says

Meeting w a Russian national is NOT "meeting w the russians." This is pure, utter garbage. It's 3rd grader type flawed logic. Just amazing to watch the brainwashing take over.

"Yuri, I met the Americans"
"Ivan, Who did you meet?"
"Pee Wee Herman, inside a movie theatre."

The Democrats have gone full McCarthy.

Loved Maddow falling for the fake Report, based on the one published by the Intercept days before.

Rew says

CBOEtrader says

Ok, since there has been at a minimum a year's worth of investigations

Hahahaha! A year! Oh dude

Yes. A year. Any normal investigation that didnt find a shred of evidence would NEVER last a year. Typically legal proceedings require evidence. Apparently not this investigation though.

TBC, Mueller isn't investigating Trump. He is investigating Russia influence on our POTUS election. It is possible the vast majority of the miscommunication is simply the fake news translation. AFAIK Mueller hasn't made any public statements about Trump, or Trump associates.

TwoScoopsMcGee says

"Yuri, I met the Americans"

"Ivan, Who did you meet?"

"Pee Wee Herman, inside a movie theatre."

Brilliant.

PCGyver says

CBOEtrader says

Yes. A year. Any normal investigation that didnt find a shred of evidence would NEVER last a year.

Benghazi?

There is hard proof of extended lies pushed by the Obama administration regarding actual crimes in Benghazi.

CBOEtrader says

Any normal investigation that didnt find a shred of evidence would NEVER last a year.

There are no limits on the timeline for an investigation. Zero. None.
The statute of limitations for a federal case is 5 years, at the time they charge with something, because they need to subpoena and take property and evidence.

Your gut felt logic is understood, but doesn't match with reality.

CBOEtrader says

Typically legal proceedings require evidence. Apparently not this investigation though.

No charges yet. No legal proceedings. We are merely looking.

"Am I being charged with something?"
"No. Would you like to disclose anything?"
"No. Am I free to go."
"Yes."

... now we go dig, did they have reason to disclose something? Ohhhhh look! They did meet with the Russians.

"Oh sorry. Yes. I forgot. Silly me."
"What did you meet about?"
"Adoption."

.... go dig again.

"You mean opposition research that would help your campaign?"
"Oh yes! That was one of the reasons, but it was primarily about adoption."
"I see. And what did they offer?"
"They said Russia was financing HRC."

... go dig again.

Do you see how the game is played yet?

CBOEtrader says

Meeting w a Russian national is NOT "meeting w the russians."

The SF-86 asks you to disclose any dealings with any foreign governments and officials. It is plural as if to ask: "Have you met with the Russians?".

Semantics cannot save you now. :)

Further, Natlaia very much represents Russian interest, as in plural. She represents the Russian state, covertly.

Rew says

Do you see how the game is played yet?

Yes. You pretend that connections to the russian government are there when they arent, and continue to dig. Well, good luck to ya. Get used to republican control at every level of government.

CBOEtrader says

Get used to republican control at every level of government.

One might see that statement as an admission that the only thing preventing GOP representatives being taken down by charges of corruption and ethical misconduct is the fact that they are protected by patronage and nepotism.

CBOEtrader says

Yes. You pretend that connections to the russian government are there when they arent, and continue to dig.

FACT: There have been multiple undisclosed dealings with known Russian agents by high level Trump campaign strategists and administration officials.

It is concerning. There are three investigations ongoing, one which is independent and on a footing to bring legal charges.

The Trump administration should(edit to add) get comfortable with being investigated. The American people are highly concerned.

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/07/10/us/politics/donald-trump-jr-russia-email-candidacy.html

Drip drip drip ... :)

By the time Jr meets with Senate it's going to be uggggggly.

Rew says

By the time Jr meets with Senate it's going to be uggggggly.

Umm, hamster wheel, spin little hamster. You guys have been at this for a year, throw something alleging it to be the great reveal-it boomerangs back and damages the dems. My prediction-more of the same-lets see.

Rew says

Trumps Son Met With Russian Lawyer After Being Promised Damaging Information on Clinton

I see nothing wrong with that. Politicians are always eager to dig up dirt on their opponents. Clinton supporters did the same thing.
Actually, if there is some serious dirt about politicians, we as citizens should know about it.

You can tell Trump's son is dumb as a post, since damaging information about the Clintons is as rare as dirt and as easy to find. No Russians required.

Ceffer says

You can tell Trump's son is dumb as a post, since damaging information about the Clintons is as rare as dirt and as easy to find. No Russians required.

There is no dirt on Hillary. I kind of liked her, and would have supported her if she became President. But she lost, so lets concentrate on Trump.

Ceffer says

You can tell Trump's son is dumb as a post, since damaging information about the Clintons is as rare as dirt and as easy to find. No Russians required.

Anyone got a rough date and timeline for when the email leaks occurred? :)

I'm not saying Trump administration leaked em, but my god, what a bunch of neophytes in a shark tank. This is what you get America for brining in complete amateurs to one of the most serious and highbrow games there is: statesmanship and diplomacy.

Anyone remember what Gore did with the information he was given on Bush? Anyone? That's right! He went right to the FBI. Smart move! Obvious trap and ethically fucked up.

If America is comfortable with Russia helping out here, I can think of a whole host of countries that might want to help the DNC. Is that where we are at? This is what we want from our Democracy?

Strategist says

I see nothing wrong with that. Politicians are always eager to dig up dirt on their opponents.

Good parrot back of the party line. Big problem! This isn't opposition research. This is a foreign power asking for quid pro quo: I give you dirt, we talk "adoptions".

Any bets on how long Mueller stays in his current position?
(Come on Trump! Do it!)

Rew says

Strategist says

I see nothing wrong with that. Politicians are always eager to dig up dirt on their opponents.

Good parrot back of the party line. Big problem! This isn't opposition research. This is a foreign power asking for quid pro quo: I give you dirt, we talk "adoptions".

Where is the evidence?

Strategist says

Where is the evidence?

Shortly after Obama clinches the Democratic nomination in the primaries of 08 the following occurs: David Axelrod, Robert Gibbs, and Malia (giggle) ... meet with a Russia "lawyer", because Malia received an email which offered dirt on McCaine. The Russian lawyer is a known advocate to try and lessen sanctions against Russia and has strong ties to former Russian intelligence agencies.

Donald Trump Jr.'s best defense here is that he is a neophyte, not that nothing is wrong. This is clearly a quid pro quo setup.

Edit: Obama maintains that he "knew nothing of the meeting".

Say it with me Trump Jr. : "The pretty Russian lady tricked me. She is mean. I didn't know any better."
Say it with me Jared: "OHHHhhhh! She was a Russian? I didn't know thaaaat!"
Say it with me Manafort: "OOoopsy dooppsy. I'm pretty screwed aren't I?"

Rew says

Strategist says

Where is the evidence?

Shortly after Obama clinches the Democratic nomination in the primaries of 08 the following occurs: David Axelrod, Robert Gibbs, and Malia (giggle) ... meet with a Russia "lawyer", because Malia received an email which offered dirt on McCaine. The Russian lawyer is a known advocate to try and lessen sanctions against Russia and has strong ties to former Russian intelligence agencies.

Donald Trump Jr.'s best defense here is that he is a neophyte, not that nothing is wrong. This is clearly a quid pro quo setup.

Edit: Obama maintains that he "knew nothing of the meeting".

In other words your original post is nothing but garbage.

Strategist says

In other words your original post is nothing but garbage.

You think 5, that's five, one now a registered foreign agent, one a known gun for hire for some of the worst political regimes in the world, have all lied MULTIPLE TIMES to cover their contacts with Russians is a nothing burger? You think an email offering dirt, from what amounts to essentially a KGB operative trying to sway American policy on sanctions (that's Natalia's main focus!) is a nothing burger?

My god man. I'm sorry. You care nothing for American values at all.

Country over party. This isn't a game of winning or losing now. This goes beyond that. The time will come to face this, or we are so seriously fucked as a country. It is clear the biggest issue facing the nation may actually be propaganda. Unreal. (This is where you say, Fake News is the real propaganda. And I laugh.)

Check the optics on this ...

"Trump Jr. has hired New York attorney Alan Futerfas to represent himself in matters regarding the Russia investigations, Reuters reported on Monday. The Daily Caller reported that Futerfas has previously represented Nikita Kuzmin, a Russian national who was found guilty of creating a malware virus that infected over 40,000 U.S. computers, including ones at NASA." Link

ROFLMAO!

Rew says

Strategist says

In other words your original post is nothing but garbage.

You think 5, that's five, one now a registered foreign agent, one a known gun for hire for some of the worst political regimes in the world, have all lied MULTIPLE TIMES to cover their contacts with Russians is a nothing burger? You think an email offering dirt, from what amounts to essentially a KGB operative trying to sway American policy on sanctions (that's Natalia's main focus!) is a nothing burger?

My god man. I'm sorry. You care nothing for American values at all.

LOL. Means nothing. Trump is the President, not his son. So what if he met with a Russian to dig up dirt.

Strategist says

LOL. Means nothing. Trump is the President, not his son. So what if he met with a Russian to dig up dirt.

Cool cool. So, just so we are clear, anyone in the next administration can do anything ... provided it isn't the President?

Ethics and treason are clearly national strong suits at this point. (eye roll)

Rew says

Strategist says

LOL. Means nothing. Trump is the President, not his son. So what if he met with a Russian to dig up dirt.

Cool cool. So, just so we are clear, anyone in the next administration can do anything ... provided it isn't the President?

Rew says

Ethics and treason are clearly national strong suits at this point. (eye roll)

We live in a free country. People can do anything they want except break the law. Since when is digging up dirt on a politician illegal?

Strategist says

We live in a free country. People can do anything they want except break the law. Since when is digging up dirt on a politician illegal?

Pretty much since we formed the country as a representative Democracy, provided the dirt comes from a foreign nation. It's kind of the point of a government for the people.

But ya know ... details.

Rew says

Strategist says

We live in a free country. People can do anything they want except break the law. Since when is digging up dirt on a politician illegal?

Pretty much since we formed the country as a representative Democracy, provided the dirt comes from a foreign nation. It's kind of the point of a government for the people.

But ya know ... details.

LOL. OK, go ahead and impeach President Trump based on your assertions.

Trump Jr. may very well have broken the law:
http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/341223-ex-bush-ethics-lawyer-on-trump-jr-meeting-with-russian-lawyer-this

Crimes here are political by nature, and it is early to say it, but 'everyone' is thinking about: treason. Everyone. Just like how everyone love that marine hat thing with Trump. Good stuff.

Strategist says

LOL. OK, go ahead and impeach President Trump based on your assertions.

Think of this like a Russian nesting doll. We keep opening the layers until we get to the round little man himself inside.

Minimally, his administration crumbles.

Even playing multi-dimensional chess, the King will be the last piece to go.

Check.

Rew says

Trump Jr. may very well have broken the law:

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/341223-ex-bush-ethics-lawyer-on-trump-jr-meeting-with-russian-lawyer-this

Crimes here are political by nature, and it is early to say it, but 'everyone' is thinking about: treason. Everyone. Just like how everyone love that marine hat thing with Trump. Good stuff.

LOL. He may have broken the law by speeding too. Good luck with you bullshit.

Strategist says

LOL. He may have broken the law by speeding too. Good luck with you bullshit.

Hmmm. Me thinks you don't think Trump Jr. needs to lawyer up. So odd? Especially since he just did that ... one who specializes in dealing with defending foreign agents committing cyber crimes! (lol)

Rew says

Strategist says

LOL. He may have broken the law by speeding too. Good luck with you bullshit.

Hmmm. Me thinks you don't think Trump Jr. needs to lawyer up. So odd? Especially since he just did that ... one who specializes in dealing with defending foreign agents committing cyber crimes! (lol)

No, I don't think Jr needs a lawyer, just like Hillary may not need a lawyer for taking millions from the Saudis.
Anyway i need to retire for the day. It's always fun arguing with someone who can take and gave shit equally, unlike the sore loser Dan.
Sweet dreams.

Strategist says

Sweet dreams.

You too. (high five)

Wonder what Jr will dream of tonight?

(shiver)

;)