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Dollar Bubble and Inflation


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2009 Nov 25, 5:00am   24,438 views  110 comments

by patientrenter   ➕follow (0)   💰tip   ignore  

Long time reader, first time poster.

Good video -

http://inflation.us/videos.html

#bubbles

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1   crash-olah   2009 Nov 25, 10:16am  

I'm really scared! that was very intense... great post, thank you!

2   patientrenter   2009 Nov 25, 3:23pm  

Did you notice what they said about cash for clunkers program, between 12-14 minutes.
That was revelation to me.

3   jackanderson129   2009 Nov 26, 8:12am  

Here is really scary and he is not trying to sell you.It's 24 pages a .pdf file.
http://www.lewrockwell.com/celente/Future-Trends-2012-Celente.pdf
And he's ben doing this for 30 years and usually right.

4   thenuttyneutron   2009 Nov 26, 8:32am  

Wow! Look at that fat kid at 11:10. He looks like he is about to chow down on McDonald's yummy food.

5   patientrenter   2009 Nov 27, 1:30am  

Nomograph

Here is some food for thought, which may give you a perspective and what I/we are trying to say.

http://www.economicpolicyjournal.com/2009/11/me-and-my-cabbie.html

patientrenter

6   theoakman   2009 Nov 27, 1:59am  

" How odd . . . that website is also devoted to selling you gold."

Those are google ads. Every website that has google ads that talks about gold will naturally have gold advertisements pop up. Speaking of gold...it's damn near 1200 now.

7   tatupu70   2009 Nov 27, 2:04am  

theoakman says

Those are google ads. Every website that has google ads that talks about gold will naturally have gold advertisements pop up. Speaking of gold…it’s damn near 1200 now.

Did you read the article? Sure looks like it is selling gold to me... Read like an infomercial.

8   thenuttyneutron   2009 Nov 27, 2:18am  

I call bull shit on the fact that I can't eat gold.

http://www.foodmall.org/entry/grand-opulence-worlds-most-expensive-sundae/

I want to trade in some of my dollars so I can sit down and eat this awsome looking desert. I will then enjoy taking a $1,000 Shit and seeing the gold in there like corn from yesterdays meal.

9   Done!   2009 Nov 27, 2:19am  

This thread must be well rounded in facts, I mean there's an Obese White kid what more proof do we need?

10   Honest Abe   2009 Nov 27, 2:36am  

Nomograph & Tatupu70...I'm shocked at your ignorant reaction to the link that patientrenter provided for you. It clearly spells out the reality of the value of gold vs. the lack of value of paper money (Paper money: aka federal reserve notes, aka tolite paper money, aka monopoly money). Yet both of you say "but, but the website is also trying to sell gold." What? As if the content of the message is invalid because they also sell gold? With all due respect - you guys are part of the problem because you don't have even a basic understanding of our so called "currency."

Gold is a store of value, paper money is not. There is no statute in America that even defines what a "dollar" is. That in itself is dishonest. There is no uniform measure of a dollar. Imagine trying to build a building without a uniform measure of what a "foot" is??? Gold (and silver) have been the most stable form of currency in the history of man. The words silver and money have the same meaning in 14 different languages around the world.

It is only when politicians begin to debase their own currency that economic problems get out of hand...like in the Roman Empire, and like whats happened in America since Nixon took America off the gold standard. America is bankrupt, morally and economically. It can no longer bamboozle the world into accepting its counterfeit currency in exchange for trade.

May I suggest that both of you go online to learn more? Google: fiat money, gold standard, The Roman Empire, inflation, etc. and learn more. A brain is a terrible thing to waste, honest.

11   knewbetter   2009 Nov 27, 3:18am  

Gold is pretty, but who the heck is going to go back to it? OH! I know! People who own it can trade it amongst themselves like Pokeman cards while the rest of us go on to widgets or digits or credits or whatever.

Gold is pretty, but it ain't money.

12   elliemae   2009 Nov 27, 3:37am  

Honest Abe says

Nomograph & Tatupu70…I’m shocked at your ignorant reaction to the link that patientrenter provided for you.

Wow - you're shocked at opinions posted on patnet? Take another prozac.

13   B.A.C.A.H.   2009 Nov 27, 4:00am  

Gold is a kind of a currency, with an exchange rate that fluctuates like currencies do. However unlike bank deposits, there's no income.

At or below ~ 750 it was a better valued currency than USD, that was the time for Americans to build up a position. Above about 1100, it is time to unwind into some great dividend paying equities.

14   knewbetter   2009 Nov 27, 4:30am  

Mr. Patientrenter is a disaster pimp, busy pimpin' out his disaster porn. Of course the money isn't in movie tickets, but when you get rushed behind the velvet rope for some golden-buttered popcorn and some free Kool-aid.

Thanks for sharing.

15   tatupu70   2009 Nov 27, 4:33am  

@ Abe--

Are you under the impression that the posters here are less knowledgeable than you? Because I can assure you that they (and I) are not. How about you do a little research of your own--find an Econ 101 textbook and read the section on currency markets and exchange rates. Turn off the AM radio and leave the crazy world is ending blogs for a little while and get a general understanding of how the world economy works.

After you read up--then you can post again...

16   theoakman   2009 Nov 27, 4:43am  

"Definitely time to sell and use the proceeds to buy a currently undervalued asset that everyone *isn’t* talking about. Investing 101."

Gold is the undervalued asset.

17   theoakman   2009 Nov 27, 4:44am  

"Did you read the article? Sure looks like it is selling gold to me… Read like an infomercial."

I think you are seeing things. At the bottom of those things, it says "Google Ads". From what I can see, the blog doesn't sell a damn thing.

18   Honest Abe   2009 Nov 27, 5:06am  

Tatupu & Nomograph, first I'd like to apologize for my intensity. I promise not be as caustic in the future. Actually I'd like you guys on "my side." As you can tell I'm very angry about how our politicians are ruining our country from the inside. Millions upon millions of people in our once great country have been financially harmed...no, I take that back - EVERY American, including those not yet born are being financially harmed, by the inept, if not criminal actions of the elite class.

Counterfeiting is a crime. Yet when our government counterfeits our currency people remain silent. Why do you think that is? Could it be that they are unaware? Or simply unknowledgeable?

Here is an example: knowbetter says: "Gold ain't money." Well, isn't money the following? (1) a medium of exchange (2) a unit of account (3) a store of value, and (4) used as payment.

Paper money is 1 and 4. But gold is all the above. So I would contend that gold IS money and paper dollars really aren't. Paper dollars are a medium of exchange...at least until people stop accepting them as payment. Paper dollars are not a unit of account because a "dollar" has no definition. There is no code, law or rule that states exactly what a dollar is. Gold on the other hand has an exact definition. It is equal to "X" number of dollars on any given day. The number of dollars can change because the value of the dollar changes...because it has no exact value. And the dollar is not a store of value, it's losing value as we speak.

When money was backed by gold and silver it was possible for anyone to walk into any bank with a one dollar silver ceritificate and exchange it for a silver dollar. Thats when money had value. Unfortunately our government took the value (silver) out of our currency. Thats called debasing the currency. Its dishonest. Thats what the Roman Empire idi prior to its collapse.

America can never have a stable economy until we have a stable currency. They are interrelated.
It seems so obvious to me that I get exasperated when others can't, or fail or refuse to recognize these things.

You know the old saying: "if you don't learn from the past you are doomed to repeat it." Aren't we all smart enough to avoid that???

19   tatupu70   2009 Nov 27, 5:17am  

Abe--

Just curious. In your mind, what happens when people start mining for gold again? It's estimated that 90% of all the gold that was/is in CA is still in the ground (or river). How would that affect gold as a "store of value"

20   Honest Abe   2009 Nov 28, 12:51am  

2ND CLASS - thanks for pointing out the obvious. Proponents of big government will never acknowledge the truth because they live in a world of "feelings", devoid of facts.

The question of an unstable dollar, debt and inflation has been answered numerous times history. But fools don't learn from history (facts) and would rather repeat the same mistakes (insanity).

The question of how big government should be is not a question of economics, per se. Its a question of freedom versus force. Every time Congress creates a new program, it necessitates the hiring of a whole new layer of bureaucracy, more lawyers, and more government agents to enforce the rules. It necessitates the forcible collection of additional new revenues and taxes.

When government spends money, no matter how noble-sounding the objectives are, freedom shrinks, and so does privacy. When everything becomes a matter of serving the "public good", the concept of individual liberty and privacy becomes as obsolete and dispensable in the minds of the political class as spoiled milk. Todays book recommendation: Common Sense by Glen Beck.

I am John Galt.

21   CrazyMan   2009 Nov 28, 6:56am  

Honest Abe says

Todays book recommendation: Common Sense by Glen Beck.

Credibility -1

Glen Beck is a complete moron.

22   crash-olah   2009 Nov 28, 1:26pm  

what about silver? gold is very high right now (compared to what it was-- and I'm not saying that it wont go higher-because I think it really might)... I want to start touching into silver, just to see... and I don't want to really hear crap that I'm stupid, or naive... but for any of those who want to give sound advise, preferably with experience... Everyone of the older/experienced people I know who've made money investing- have done so in real estate--- and obviously I'm not touching that! so please, if you have any advise, I'm definitely all ears, I'd like to do a bit of research before jumping the gun

23   thenuttyneutron   2009 Nov 28, 2:42pm  

Crash-Olah,

I have not bought any gold/silver. Just remember that you will have to protect it if you keep a physical supply of it. I don't trust those etfs that say you own gold but you can't touch it. I have seen how counterfeit stuff can be when working on an electronic exchange (naked short selling).

I really think the best thing to do is get something productive. An acre of land and an education on how to grow something edible would be the thing I would go for. I just bought a 2/3 acre lot in Ohio and I am building an energy efficient home here (ICF) after moving north from Texas (where I was born) 5 years ago.

My mom came from a town about 50 miles from me and she told me about Depression gardens. Her grandmother would grow lots of stuff and can it. This food would supplement the winter foods that they had to buy. They could not grow enough for all their food, but they were able to really cut the expenses down. The grandma never dropped the habit even when times got better.

I want to enjoy life and not worry so much about all this crap. I am cynical now about the whole damn blunder that we call an economy. Along with learning the skills on how to grow and preserve food, I also want to learn how to make beer. Cheers.

-TNN

24   nope   2009 Nov 28, 3:12pm  

Honest Abe says

He’s a proponent of things like free speech,

Except when it's critical of him and he files lawsuits to censor people.

private property, individual liberty, privacy rights,

Unless one's preferred liberties and privacy has anything to do with being gay or not wanting religion interferring with your government.

personal responsibility,

So long as it's not taking responsibility for irresponsible lies that you tell that incites people to violence.

freedom, the rule of law…you know, things that you, liberals and elitists hate.

Yeah, "liberals" hate freedom! (I hope everyone appreciates the absurdity of that statement).

By the way, Glenn Beck is an "Elitist". You think he's some working class schlub? Get real.

25   totallyscrewed   2009 Nov 28, 5:10pm  

thenuttyneutron says

I also want to learn how to make beer. Cheers.

Google morebeer. You can make your own to rival any micro brew at about $.50 a bottle. Probably wont save you much over buying a 12 pack of pabst, but damn worth it for good beer. I considered growing beer from the ground up for kicks, but with the amount of water, energy and other supplies, it doesn't really add up. Buy malted barley and go for it. Not really rocket science and you'd be surprised what you get in the first shot.

26   Honest Abe   2009 Nov 28, 11:09pm  

ARGUING WITH IDIOTS, none of you have read the book. I could tell by your incorrect assumptions on virtually all points you attempted to make.

Todays book: 1984, by George Orwell.

TotallyScrewed123, I totally enjoyed your posts. Sounds like a good project - too bad I quit drinking. Cheers, Abe.

27   nope   2009 Nov 29, 5:47am  

Honest Abe says

ARGUING WITH IDIOTS, none of you have read the book. I could tell by your incorrect assumptions on virtually all points you attempted to make.
Todays book: 1984, by George Orwell.
TotallyScrewed123, I totally enjoyed your posts. Sounds like a good project - too bad I quit drinking. Cheers, Abe.

I've never smoked crack either -- I suppose I can't say that it's bad for you?

Unless Beck is writing books that are nothing like his TV show, the book is trash.

Orwell was a giant "liberal" by the way.

28   Honest Abe   2009 Nov 29, 11:14am  

Ummm, let me see, you acknowledge you haven't read "Common Sense"...yet you claim it's trash, and the author is a moron, haha.

Todays book: The Vampire Economy, by Gunter Reimann.

Oh, wait a minute, are you fools going to say Gunter is a moron and his book is trash - again, without reading it?

Koo-Koo, Koo-Koo.

29   thomas.wong87   2009 Nov 29, 11:44am  

"There were FAR more economic controls under Nixon than exist today, in fact it’s not even close. NO ONE, and I do mean NO ONE with any knowledge of history would argue otherwise."

So the countless FASB pronouncements / SEC guidelines and regulations effecting business over the past some 30 years don't count ?

Nothing wrong with being Ultranationalist or do you sing the "International" everyday ?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pm7dHfw6hmE&feature=related

Walk into the Vietnamese community in San Jose and tell them your story.
How do you think they will react?

30   thomas.wong87   2009 Nov 29, 1:04pm  

I doubt you even knew such regulations even existed.
SEC Final Rules http://www.sec.gov/rules/final.shtml

"600%"
So your using the activities of the mafia/gangs as being legit business practices. Nice going.

Deregulation in the 1980s like Telecom and Airlines? Do you recall how much it cost to fly or
make a phone call before that? Didn't prices of both fall making it easy for consumers to travel more?
I doubt you were even around.

Do you think you would have access to internet and able to make be logged on for hours for small flat monthly fee. Did it take regulations to see prices fall? Nope! Look at your cell phone,
You think that was possible under regulated telecom industry? Not a chance!

31   thomas.wong87   2009 Nov 29, 1:16pm  

"mortgage bonds, sub-prime lending, huge segments of the derivatives market, and gambling"

http://iperceive.net/hidden-clinton-success-story-fannie-mae-subprime-loans-for-minorities/

32   nope   2009 Nov 29, 5:30pm  

thomas.wong87 says

I doubt you even knew such regulations even existed.

SEC Final Rules http://www.sec.gov/rules/final.shtml
“600%”

So your using the activities of the mafia/gangs as being legit business practices. Nice going.

Do you even know what payday loans are or how they work? Yes, interest rates *are* in the 600% range.

Deregulation in the 1980s like Telecom and Airlines? Do you recall how much it cost to fly or

make a phone call before that? Didn’t prices of both fall making it easy for consumers to travel more?

I doubt you were even around.
Do you think you would have access to internet and able to make be logged on for hours for small flat monthly fee. Did it take regulations to see prices fall? Nope! Look at your cell phone,

You think that was possible under regulated telecom industry? Not a chance!

The breakup of AT&T was what dropped telecom prices. It turns out that markets with competition (the actual reason that capitalism works, which seems to be lost on a lot of so-called "conservatives" these days) are far better for consumers than markets with monopolies.

Find me one credible analyst or economist who disagrees with the above paragraph.

Overall, regulations on telcos are actually stronger than they were under ma bell. Price restrictions went away (since there was no longer a monopoly, it wasn't necessary), but we then introduced requirements like common carrier status and e-911.

Mobile phone technology also had very very little to do with anything regarding regulation. In fact, it was the introduction of Microwave technology (do you know what MCI stands for?) that convinced the justice department that AT&T was not a "natural" monopoly and that the market would thrive if it was broken up.

33   crash-olah   2009 Dec 2, 12:41am  

thenuttyneutron says

Crash-Olah,
I have not bought any gold/silver. Just remember that you will have to protect it if you keep a physical supply of it. I don’t trust those etfs that say you own gold but you can’t touch it. I have seen how counterfeit stuff can be when working on an electronic exchange (naked short selling).
I really think the best thing to do is get something productive. An acre of land and an education on how to grow something edible would be the thing I would go for. I just bought a 2/3 acre lot in Ohio and I am building an energy efficient home here (ICF) after moving north from Texas (where I was born) 5 years ago.
My mom came from a town about 50 miles from me and she told me about Depression gardens. Her grandmother would grow lots of stuff and can it. This food would supplement the winter foods that they had to buy. They could not grow enough for all their food, but they were able to really cut the expenses down. The grandma never dropped the habit even when times got better.
I want to enjoy life and not worry so much about all this crap. I am cynical now about the whole damn blunder that we call an economy. Along with learning the skills on how to grow and preserve food, I also want to learn how to make beer. Cheers.
-TNN

thanks for the suggestion, but I probably will not be buying land, or harvesting it for that matter, as this would take a lot of time and money, not to mention moving my family, etc. Since this original post was posted, I've been watching gold/silver out of the corner of my eye, and it's gone up- a lot! I've asked advise of family/friends who have invested money(in stock, housing, etc), and (no big surprise) they all said housing is the way to go... however, I do believe they can make it, as they aren't flippers and would be paying all cash- however, I'm not in a financial situation to do that as I'm about 50 years younger, and have never owned a house. No one I PERSONALLY know has tried PM's besides one of my friends about 6 months ago. 6 months is not a lot of time, so obviously that's not much to go off of. I plan on doing some more research before buying anyway, and I'm in no big rush- since the prices are just going higher and higher, they are expecting a POSSIBLE pullback anyway. Has anyone personally invested in gold/silver. and how do you start? advice? tips,websites, etc. I'm eager to learn about it, and maybe take a risk...

34   simchaland   2009 Dec 2, 9:18am  

Back to gold and silver. Both are also fiat currencies. Yes, yes, yes, most of we humans like the shiny stuff and place a high value on it. Still WE decide how much goods and services gold and silver can by. There is no intrinsic value for either metal. Both metals have their industrial uses. However how WE value either metal is based on our SUBJECTIVE judgment on what these metals can actually buy. It's basically the same as the old barter system but you are using only one or two elements as "currency." All parties in any transaction must agree what to exchange for what. Using currency whether it be paper, shells, metals, knots, ribbons, or whatever is way more efficient than bartering because the currency can be traded without having to deliver actual goods or services immediately and it serves as a place holder for value when traded.

So, no matter what we humans choose to use as "currency" we are all playing Jedi mind tricks in assigning value to whatever we use as currency relative to goods and services.

Gold and silver are not necessarily the universal currencies people claim they are. There isn't enough to go around to make transactions efficient and we used to spend vast amounts of effort (money and time) to transport the stuff to make transactions happen.

Eventually we will be moving toward electronic "credits" as currency because paper and coins will eventually become less and less efficient as technology advances. So get ready for we humans to invent yet another monetary system and to assign value to whatever we are going to use in trade for goods and services.

35   Vicente   2009 Dec 2, 11:00am  

The INFLATION BOOGEYMAN!

If you don't go out and SPEND SPEND SPEND my dear consumer, then you will be PRICED OUT FOREVER.

Yep that's the whole game plan. Nobody should ever save anything. You should spend money you don't even have yet. This is what your masters are attempting to convince you of. Slavery is Freedom. Debt is Money.

The underpinning of this system is keeping you in MORTAL FEAR that your dollars will evaporate if you let them sit. They drum this into you at every opportunity. They refuse to acknowledge even the possibility of deflation, because if you were to stop believing in the INFLATION BOOGEYMAN for even a second, then their power over you would evaporate and their position would be undercut. It is your PATRIOTIC DUTY to wear this yoke and transform yourself from citizen into "consumer" and keep THEIR...errr "our" system afloat.

36   B.A.C.A.H.   2009 Dec 2, 11:08am  

Under about 750/oz gold was a better store of value than federal reserve notes.

If our standard of living has fallen over the past 30 years with the increase in two-wage-earner households then I reckon a repeat of Jan 1980 bubble price might be about 1600 USD. But it was a different world in 1980, buyers of gold then did not include folks from Mainland China.

37   Honest Abe   2009 Dec 2, 11:30am  

Gold and silver are NOT fiat currency. Fiat currency is money that is declared by government to be legal tender. Gold and silver historically replace fiat currency when it finally became worthless, every time in the last 3,000 years. "Paper money always returns to its original value - zero." Thats the direction of the US dollar, because it is a fiat currency...backed by nothing.

Gold is the money of Kings
Silver is the money of Gentlemen
Barter is the money common men
Debt is the money of slaves

The words silver and money are the same in 14 different languages. And gold and silver are universal, everywhere, easily converted to the local currency anywhere in the world. Thats because they have inherent value.

There is no definition of a dollar anywhere. There is no statue or law anywhere in America the states exactly what a dollar is. Thats because its a fiat currency and the government says it can be used as a medium of exchange, yet it has no value.

Imagine if there was no definition for a "gallon". No standard measure. You pay for 20 "gallons" but only get say, 8 or 10 gallons. People would not put up with that type of dishonesty. But thats the type of dishonest money system we have with a fiat currency system. That is specifically why America needs sound currency, NOT a free floating, fiat currency, without any value what so ever.

38   B.A.C.A.H.   2009 Dec 2, 2:25pm  

Maybe not a formal definition, but here are some practical definitions, at least till they change:

a dollar is equivalent store of value to one twelve-hundredth of an ounce of gold or to an eightyth of a barrel of oil, or a third of a gallon of gasoline.

It's also equivalent to about 8 minutes of the minimum wage.

39   simchaland   2009 Dec 3, 6:51am  

Honest Abe.,

The only reason why these metals have any value is because we have decided that they have value. There is no "intrinsic value" to any of these metals. People can change their minds at any time around how much of a certain metal they will accept for a certain good or service. The value of these metals fluctuate vis-a-vis goods and services too. They do not have static values for goods and services unless a government steps in and assigns static values for goods and services.

The government could do the same thing with our paper money too. They could dictate what kind/how much/how many goods and services a dollar buys. I believe the Soviet Union tried that with their Ruble. If we have a free market capitalist system, the value of these metals vis-a-vis goods and services fluctuate according to the laws of supply and demand, just like paper dollars.

So, no matter what you use as "currency" we humans decide whether or not something has value and whether or not wee should use any medium for exchange. It's psychology that makes metals, paper notes, shells, knots, ribbons, rocks, etc. have "value." What someone is willing to trade for a certain marker that "stores value" is what that marker is worth.

So, even if we go back to a gold standard, the value of gold will fluctuate vis-a-vis goods and services in a free market system without central planning from a government. There is no guarantee of economic stabilization with a gold standard. It's just another marker that holds value because we humans decided that it has value. How much value can gold hold? Well, that depends on what a person at any given time will exchange for a certain amount of gold. It's the same basic principle of a fiat currency, sorry. Metals have no intrinsic value besides being shiny and having properties that make them useful for industry. Paper bills can be used for other purposes besides using them as currency too (scrap paper, fire starter, packaging material, etc.).

40   tatupu70   2009 Dec 3, 7:01am  

@Abe

Furthermore, you can devalue gold just like paper money. Go mine some more of it. Exactly the same as running a printing press.

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