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What makes a country?


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2021 Jun 12, 8:48pm   380 views  20 comments

by Patrick   ➕follow (55)   💰tip   ignore  

From Aristotle's Politics:


It is clear therefore that the state is not (just) an association of people living in the same territory, established to prevent its members from committing injustice against each other, and to promote commercial transactions. Certainly all these features must be present if there is to be a state; but even the presence of every one of them does not make a state from these facts alone. The state is an association intended to enable its members in their households and kinships to live well; its purpose is a perfect and self-sufficient life. However this will not be obtained unless they occupy one and the same territory and intermarry... All these activities are the product of affection, for it is our affection for each other that causes us to live together...


Interesting that what makes a country, for Aristotle, is the mutual affection of citizens for each other, and their intermarriage.

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1   Onvacation   2021 Jun 12, 9:34pm  

Patrick asks
What makes a country?


Aristotle says
The state is an association intended to enable its members in their households and kinships to live well; its purpose is a perfect and self-sufficient life.

Self sufficient within the state.

Michael Savage says
Borders, Language, Culture


I think Michael has it right. A country is first defined by its borders, and then it's language and culture.
2   Onvacation   2021 Jun 12, 9:35pm  

I took a college sociology class years ago. Besides learning about Marx and Weber, I learned that all successful countries have three things in common: Family, Religion, and Warfare. Whenever a country abandons one of these institutions the country is "eclipsed" by a country that has not given up these principles.
3   RC2006   2021 Jun 12, 9:54pm  

One people calling the shots.

The excuse that the US has always been a melting pot is BS it was a conglomerate of Europeans. Diversity of completely alien incompatible cultures is wreaking the West and its being done purposefully nothing about it is organic.
4   Ceffer   2021 Jun 12, 10:04pm  

Aristotle would have loved Appalachia.
5   Patrick   2021 Jun 12, 10:08pm  

Onvacation says
all successful countries have three things in common: Family, Religion, and Warfare


I had not considered the difference between a nation and a country until recently. A nation is defined by common genetic origin:

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/nation

from Latin nātiōnem, accusative of (g)nātiō (“nation, race, birth”) from (g)nātus, past participle stem of (g)nāscī (“to be born”)


But a country is defined only by the territory:

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/country#Etymology

borrowed from Old French contree, from Vulgar Latin (terra) contrāta (“(land) lying opposite; (land) spread before”)


I think a nation has to be the more stable entity in the long run.
6   Patrick   2021 Jun 12, 10:10pm  

Also, a single religion probably contributes greatly to unity.

Like most liberals, I used to be opposed to religion in general, and to any state religion in particular. But now I see that a common religion has a great unifying effect.

This is why the Spanish colonies were all quite deliberately Catholic, and their mission system was established as an advance form of colonization.

And this is one reason Ireland was hard for the English empire to digest. They would not become Anglican but remained resolutely Catholic.
7   Patrick   2021 Jun 12, 10:11pm  

Ceffer says
Aristotle would have loved Appalachia.


Lol, Appalachia probably does have pretty good unity and mutual aid, though there are limits to how closely you want to marry.
8   Ceffer   2021 Jun 12, 10:38pm  

New Yorker had an amusing article about 'justice' in Appalachia. So much inbreeding and clan/family loyalties, getting convictions for crimes from juries (often of relatives and allies) was highly dependent on 'who' the accused was. Lots of guilty going free, even for murders if the victims weren't local.
9   Patrick   2021 Jun 12, 10:45pm  

I suppose even when most people are interrelated, they still identify with a specific clan, as in Somalia.
10   Misc   2021 Jun 13, 4:49am  

The British drew those lines on the map of the Middle East for a reason.
11   GNL   2021 Jun 13, 5:41am  

Language
Culture
Borders

=

Country
12   FuckTheMainstreamMedia   2021 Jun 13, 3:31pm  

This is entirely the theme of Fear of The Walking Dead. So far in my watching, every mini society that gets built is torn apart by outsiders who are welcome into the community, but then proceed to destroy it.
13   AmericanKulak   2021 Jun 13, 6:40pm  

WineHorror1 says
Language
Culture
Borders

=

Country

SAVAGE!
14   GNL   2021 Jun 13, 6:48pm  

MisdemeanorRebellionNoCoupForYou says
WineHorror1 says
Language
Culture
Borders

=

Country

SAVAGE!

That's from Mark Levin.
15   FortwayeAsFuckJoeBiden   2021 Jun 13, 6:57pm  

Culture uniting people. It falls apart without unifying culture.
16   AmericanKulak   2021 Jun 13, 7:40pm  

WineHorror1 says
That's from Mark Levin.


Michael Savage has been saying "Borders, Language, Culture" as a slogan for his radio program for decades now.

By the way, despite high ratings he was pretty much run out of radio this year, he's too anti-woke.
https://nationalfile.com/borders-language-culture-talk-show-titan-michael-savage-says-he-will-leave-radio-airwaves-in-2021/
17   FortwayeAsFuckJoeBiden   2021 Jun 13, 8:30pm  

MisdemeanorRebellionNoCoupForYou says
WineHorror1 says
That's from Mark Levin.


Michael Savage has been saying "Borders, Language, Culture" as a slogan for his radio program for decades now.

By the way, despite high ratings he was pretty much run out of radio this year, he's too anti-woke.
https://nationalfile.com/borders-language-culture-talk-show-titan-michael-savage-says-he-will-leave-radio-airwaves-in-2021/


Feels like left is winning at destroying America.
18   GNL   2021 Jun 13, 8:36pm  

MisdemeanorRebellionNoCoupForYou says
WineHorror1 says
That's from Mark Levin.


Michael Savage has been saying "Borders, Language, Culture" as a slogan for his radio program for decades now.

By the way, despite high ratings he was pretty much run out of radio this year, he's too anti-woke.
https://nationalfile.com/borders-language-culture-talk-show-titan-michael-savage-says-he-will-leave-radio-airwaves-in-2021/

Ooops, Michael Savage. Yep.
19   Patrick   2021 Jun 13, 9:29pm  

You can still listen to him on his site:

https://michaelsavage.com/

Interesting guy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Savage
20   rocketjoe79   2021 Jun 14, 10:53am  

The success of America is the ability citizens to live in freedom, while assimilating other cultures. We respect and even promote most other decent cultural norms. We reject hate and exploitation. Hence the reluctance of everyday Americans to condone or accept radical religious tenets, while still allowing them to exist within our borders.

For example, Mennonites, Islamists, Buddists, Latter Day Saints, and Jehovah Witnessers are allowed to practice within our country. A literal interpretation of many of these religions' published beliefs aren't allowed in the USA. When religious practice runs afoul of the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, we say no. Or the Supreme Court steps in and makes a decision.

So, if you're ok with "watering down" your religion to live in the USA, come here legally and live peacefully with the rest of us. Otherwise, you're welcome to practice elsewhere.

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