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1   SunnyvaleCA   2019 May 2, 11:26am  

California is a "sanctuary state" with its arms open to billions of people. California can't build housing for billions. People will only stop coming to California because of immigration laws or when the quality of life and work opportunities is WORSE here than the 3rd-world countries they are coming from.

I propose fixing the housing shortage by enforcing all existing immigration laws and reducing immigration to — at most — keep the population steady.
2   Blue   2019 May 2, 1:13pm  

OccasionalCortex says
NIMBY make-believe 'constitutional right' to outrageous gains in capital gains on their houses

1. In fact propose a tax on NIMBY properties (how about additional 2%) for the pleasure of excluding new people, particularly young and productive.
2. Repealing stone soup Prop 13 to put all properties of all types get them back in line with current 1% flat will make everything affordable. Add additional tax on non owner occupied, foreign owned etc. like lot of countries started doing, that will make it even much more affordable.
3. Stop "affordable housing" for government chosen 1% "winners". This is subsidizing rich people/companies so that they do not have to pay the market rate in that area. This is an excuse for government not to work on the right policy to get real market driven housing for the remaining population.
3   SunnyvaleCA   2019 May 2, 2:23pm  

Blue says
An add additional tax on non owner occupied, foreign owned etc.
One part-way solution would be to allow Prop 13 to be claimed ONLY on primary residence. If you're not occupying, it's not your primary residence. If not a citizen, the USA isn't your primary country and so house isn't your primary residence and so no Prop 13 (you're also not paying federal income tax on your income earned outside the USA, so you have a tax advantage in other areas of US citizens). If not a "person" (i.e. owned by a business) it's not a primary residence. If you claim out-of-state for evading CA income tax, it's not your primary.
4   cmdrda2leak   2019 May 2, 3:14pm  

SunnyvaleCA says
Blue says
An add additional tax on non owner occupied, foreign owned etc.
One part-way solution would be to allow Prop 13 to be claimed ONLY on primary residence. If you're not occupying, it's not your primary residence. If not a citizen, the USA isn't your primary country and so house isn't your primary residence and so no Prop 13 (you're also not paying federal income tax on your income earned outside the USA, so you have a tax advantage in other areas of US citizens). If not a "person" (i.e. owned by a business) it's not a primary residence. If you claim out-of-state for evading CA income tax, it's not your primary.


One problem here: renters. If the prop tax is free to soar on rental properties, that increase will be passed along to renters, sending average rents soaring. Worse, in municipalities with rent control, the landlords won't be able to pass the tax increase along as rent, margins could erode or even go negative. Consequence: no money available for property maintenance and improvement, buildings deteriorate,... if landlord is way underwater, buildings become unsellable. this happened in bronx in the 70s... the economics of it got so upside-down that buildings were burned down for the insurance
6   Blue   2019 May 2, 6:22pm  

cmdrdataleak says
One problem here: renters. If the prop tax is free to soar on rental properties, that increase will be passed along to renters, sending average rents soaring.


Stone soup "CA Prop 13" is the cause, "out of control soaring" is the ill effect.

Here is an example.
A house bought in 1980 at $225k at prop 13 (2% max cap) tax after about 40 years, it becomes about 500k (25*1.02**40 = 497) on government record.
At 1% rate owner pays about $5k tax but collects rent at market rate $36k-100k+on property at market rate of $1-5+ million in bay area.
Take a conservative 5% growth rate (actually its double digits lately for the last few years) 225*1.05**40=$1.584 million.

Here is the interesting thing, if one has to pay current 1% tax on $1.584m = 15.83k, which is $10k+ more than stone soup prop 13 rate, enough houses go to market and control "out of control soaring" prices.

A free market economy has self correcting mechanism if we let it happen.
THIS IS WHY MARKET ECONOMY IS NOT BAD FOR MANY REASONS. NO MORE STONE SOUP FOR YOU :)

This also helps CA Cadillac grand maa sets free, make tons of $$$ and move on happily to one of her dream places.
This also helps CA owners not to force them-self to be NIMBY militants.
This also helps CA owners not to pretend like a pan handlers while holding multi million $ properties around.
This also helps CA owners not to pretend that have 1970's (or old) house to keep prop 13 tax base though they have build brand new multi million $ house (people know this trick who replaced old house with new by keeping some junk around from old house!)

But the reality is, if for any reason if god comes around and talk about CA prop 13 great tradition, CA owners will chase him to the hell!
7   B.A.C.A.H.   2019 May 2, 7:11pm  

More affordable housing will lead to more traffic, more congestion, more misery, and enable the employers to entice more worker bees, including more H-1's to whom this place is uncrowded with Bargain Prices, more crowding, more traffic, more congestion, rinse and repeat.
8   SunnyvaleCA   2019 May 2, 9:16pm  

cmdrdataleak says
If the prop tax is free to soar on rental properties, that increase will be passed along to renters, sending average rents soaring.
That's a good thing. Those 50-year "land hoarders" will sell their houses and people wishing to occupy will be able to buy. Prop 13 skewerse towards renters, which aren't really a great way to make a community.
9   cmdrda2leak   2019 May 2, 10:46pm  

SunnyvaleCA says
cmdrdataleak says
If the prop tax is free to soar on rental properties, that increase will be passed along to renters, sending average rents soaring.
That's a good thing. Those 50-year "land hoarders" will sell their houses and people wishing to occupy will be able to buy. Prop 13 skewerse towards renters, which aren't really a great way to make a community.


You may have trouble selling a house that already has a tenant with a locked-in rent, amid the backdrop of ever increasing prop taxes. No potential buyer would take that losing proposition.
10   Blue   2019 May 3, 1:13am  

cmdrdataleak says
SunnyvaleCA says
cmdrdataleak says
If the prop tax is free to soar on rental properties, that increase will be passed along to renters, sending average rents soaring.
That's a good thing. Those 50-year "land hoarders" will sell their houses and people wishing to occupy will be able to buy. Prop 13 skewerse towards renters, which aren't really a great way to make a community.


You may have trouble selling a house that already has a tenant with a locked-in rent, amid the backdrop of ever increasing prop taxes. No potential buyer would take that losing proposition.


Ill effect of Prop 13 created a bad optics. If everyone pays a fixed % (currently 1%) tax, that controls the "soaring problem" and you wouldn't have the issue to begin with.
Because you are playing double standard game of "keeping tax difference that otherwise goes to the government" (which is a subsidy) of prop 13 rate vs market value - the property soars to reflect that gain.
In fact you do not care how high it goes as your tax is set at 2% cap. If prop 13 is gone the price is very likely adjusts to the current market value, no magic math involved.
"No potential buyer would take" - may be true if the price is very high. List at market or just below market - there is always a buyer out there.
11   Blue   2019 May 3, 1:28am  

B.A.C.A.H. says
more traffic, more congestion


Lot of employers are paying much less than 1%. If all employers are get back in line for standard 1% flat tax, most employers will "adjust" staff around in few weeks/months. Very likely that should solve "traffic" problems. In fact it is good for near by cities competing for new business.
Repeal Prop 13 and make CA great again.
12   🎂 Tenpoundbass   2019 May 3, 9:00am  

Not more housing, more Cities!
America hasn't built a new on in over 80 years.
13   Hand_Of_Glory   2019 May 3, 9:07am  

Affordable housing is code for "projects." This is a money grab by politicians. They make cheap housing, pocket large portions of the cash and spread it around to their favorite developers(usually lobbyists.) Projects almost always decrease home values and increase crime.

Oddly enough, theres no projects in any of the areas that your local/state/country politicians live, go figure.

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