patrick.net

bg says

How have the rates of reverse mortgages changed over time?

is (roughly) the variable interest rate on LOC RMs.

Why go with a reverse mortgage when you can obtain a HELOC at 4.25% IO payment with no docs? You only pay for the interest on the money you're taking out instead of the constant monthly withdraw from the bank whether or not you need it.

Only a complete idiot will reverse mortgage when every options are better. It's by far the most expensive way to access money.

Scam and predatory lending against the unsuspecting seniors.

E-man says

Why go with a reverse mortgage when you can obtain a HELOC at 4.25% IO payment with no docs? You only pay for the interest on the money you're taking out instead of the constant monthly withdraw from the bank whether or not you need it.

Which bank requires no docs? I thought they all require full docs.

E-man says

Why go with a reverse mortgage when you can obtain a HELOC at 4.25% IO payment with no docs? You only pay for the interest on the money you're taking out instead of the constant monthly withdraw from the bank whether or not you need it.

You cannot do it for life. With a reverse mortgage you never have to make payments.

SFace says

Only a complete idiot will reverse mortgage when every options are better. It's by far the most expensive way to access money.

Why is that? What are the negatives?

FortWayne says

Scam and predatory lending against the unsuspecting seniors.

It is a government program to help seniors. Why scam?

Reverse mortgage is subprime. Total interest cost is way higher all in. Insurance, fees, points. Like all subprime borrower or reverse mortage, it is simply pissing money away. Why be a subprime when you dont have to? Just basic common sense

Seniors stress over saving a couple bucks on meals, but too stupid to realize they are pissing away thousands with a reverse mortage every year. Penny wise, dollar foolish.

Strategist says

It is a government program to help seniors. Why scam?

Government isn't making money off it, individual brokers do. In our neighborhood we have a lot of seniors, and brings all kinds of reverse mortgage scumbags. They misrepresent the facts about it, making it look like it's there to help, while seniors end up losing their houses. It's not a simple program, there are a lot of little details and fine print.

Strategist says

E-man says

Why go with a reverse mortgage when you can obtain a HELOC at 4.25% IO payment with no docs? You only pay for the interest on the money you're taking out instead of the constant monthly withdraw from the bank whether or not you need it.

Which bank requires no docs? I thought they all require full docs.

Any Chinese bank like East West Bank, Cathay Bank, China Trust, etc will do it. Loan is up to 60% LTV. Absolutely no docs. I got 3 loans from them, 1 last year and 2 this year.

How about "sell the fucking house and rent/buy someplace cheap"?

You can invest most of the money and live in a place better suited to an elderly person, as far as both internal floor plan and external transportation needs.

Attachment to material things, like a house, is explicitly dissed in the scriptures of every major religion. Ever wonder why? It's not a road to happiness.

Fucking fucks....

Bellingham Bill says

bg says

How have the rates of reverse mortgages changed over time?

is (roughly) the variable interest rate on LOC RMs.

LIBOR was horrendously manipulated you know.

FortWayne says

Strategist says

It is a government program to help seniors. Why scam?

Government isn't making money off it, individual brokers do. In our neighborhood we have a lot of seniors, and brings all kinds of reverse mortgage scumbags. They misrepresent the facts about it, making it look like it's there to help, while seniors end up losing their houses. It's not a simple program, there are a lot of little details and fine print.

Asset stripping while they are on the way to the nursing home.

SFace says

Reverse mortgage is subprime. Total interest cost is way higher all in. Insurance, fees, points. Like all subprime borrower or reverse mortage, it is simply pissing money away. Why be a subprime when you dont have to? Just basic common sense

Seniors stress over saving a couple bucks on meals, but too stupid to realize they are pissing away thousands with a reverse mortage every year. Penny wise, dollar foolish.

FortWayne says

Strategist says

It is a government program to help seniors. Why scam?

Government isn't making money off it, individual brokers do. In our neighborhood we have a lot of seniors, and brings all kinds of reverse mortgage scumbags. They misrepresent the facts about it, making it look like it's there to help, while seniors end up losing their houses. It's not a simple program, there are a lot of little details and fine print.

The brokers may be crooks, but the reverse mortgage program was designed to help seniors stay in their homes and not get scammed by hard money lenders. No payments are required, you can get a monthly draw, and you are guaranteed to live their until you die. The interest rates seem pretty reasonable too. As always, know who you are dealing with, and if in doubt just go with a major bank.

Thanks everyone for your replies. It tends to have the feel of a scam to me, but that is just an impression. I don't now the details. I guess I was thinking that we interpret a lot of data here and try to use it to predict where things are going. I was wondering it the rates of reverse mortgages informed predictions about the future of housing..

I saw OC reference something about how boomers are not selling and aren't going to sell in mass. Maybe if reverses are going up, ti would give credence to the idea that people are planning to stay put.

I have to say that as my mom got older she was more susceptible to scams because she literally couldn't track the details of things. So, if she had needed money, someone might have been able to trick her easily. Luckily, we look after her, so there isn''t a chance of that. But given her cognitive limitations, she would have been vulnerable in a way that she hadn't been in the past.

I agree about selling and downsizing as a sensible solution. I just wondered about the trends in reverse mortgages and how the frequent flyers would interpret those.

bg says

I have to say that as my mom got older she was more susceptible to scams because she literally couldn't track the details of things. So, if she had needed money, someone might have been able to trick her easily. Luckily, we look after her, so there isn''t a chance of that. But given her cognitive limitations, she would have been vulnerable in a way that she hadn't been in the past.

The elderly are always the targets of scumbags. I'm glad you look out for your mom.

Strategist says

The brokers may be crooks, but the reverse mortgage program was designed to help seniors stay in their homes and not get scammed by hard money lenders.

But the new scammers who are hard money lenders are the guys handing out reverse mortgages. They just take advantage of the seniors these days. It gets pretty interesting if you bring up surviving spouse benefits into it.

If I were elected dictator, I would outlaw reverse mortgages.

zzyzzx says

If I were elected dictator, I would outlaw reverse mortgages.

Great that will leave more money for the Liberals to tax the estate after the parents death, so the kids don't get any inheritance. This is more about ending people who had a head start in life, than it is about what is right or wrong.

zzyzzx says

If I were elected dictator, I would outlaw reverse mortgages.

zzyzzx for president 2016.

CaptainShuddup says

Great that will leave more money for the Liberals to tax the estate after the parents death, so the kids don't get any inheritance. This is more about ending people who had a head start in life, than it is about what is right or wrong.

How so? I'd be forcing seniors to downsize instead, as they should.

zzyzzx says

CaptainShuddup says

Great that will leave more money for the Liberals to tax the estate after the parents death, so the kids don't get any inheritance. This is more about ending people who had a head start in life, than it is about what is right or wrong.

How so? I'd be forcing seniors to downsize instead, as they should.

What are you gonna do about:
welfare
immigration
Mid East

This is simply one more mechanism for transferring the wealth from the middle to the upper classes. I get that some feel they have no choice (and maybe they don't) but it's a transfer, nevertheless, flown under the flag of "helping the elderly."

Strategist says

welfare

immigration

Mid East

Eliminate welfare
Seal the border, land mines and troops with M134's should do the trick. Provide a bounty for each dead illegal alien brought in.
There is really only one solution for the middle east, and that's a US that does not import any oil from them, or anyone else except maybe Canada. I would ban the use of home heating oil, since everyone can use clean domestic natural gas or pellets, or propane. I would use natural gas to power trucks and most cars would be electric or natural gas. I would free up a bunch of natural gas by shutting down natural gas powered plants in favor of nuclear, coal, and renewables. IMO, there is no real solution to the middle east, except MAYBE to take away their money and keep it at home in the US where it belongs. When we don't need their oil any more, they can kill each other all they want and it won't matter to us. Plus they won't have the money for weapons for modern warfare so they will have to resort to slingshots and clubs anyway.

zzyzzx says

Eliminate welfare

Seal the border, land mines and troops with M134's should do the trick. Provide a bounty for each dead illegal alien brought in.

There is really only one solution for the middle east, and that's a US that does not import any oil from them, or anyone else except maybe Canada. I would ban the use of home heating oil, since everyone can use clean domestic natural gas or pellets, or propane. I would use natural gas to power trucks and most cars would be electric or natural gas. I would free up a bunch of natural gas by shutting down natural gas powered plants in favor of nuclear, coal, and renewables. IMO, there is no real solution to the middle east, except MAYBE to take away their money and keep it at home in the US where it belongs. When we don't need their oil any more, they can kill each other all they want and it won't matter to us. Plus they won't have t

What about Iranian nukes?
If you answer correctly I will pronounce Dictator Zzyzzx.

zzyzzx says

Seal the border, land mines and troops with M134's should do the trick. Provide a bounty for each dead illegal alien brought in.

Much easier, fine businesses for hiring illegals some rather large arbitrary value like 250,000 per illegal. Practice of hiring illegals would seize within a year.