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16   bmwman91   2012 Apr 19, 3:49am  

Hysteresis says

i equate low intelligence with low income. sorry if the income part was wrong.

LOL....burrrrrrrrrrrrrrnnnnnnnned

17   bmwman91   2012 Apr 19, 3:51am  

Vicente says

When you're on your deathbed I'm sure piles of money will be very heartwarming and eager to hold your hand.

This is true. Having kids, or not having them, is an intensely personal choice. Both are frought with big compromises. Both can be rationalized and justified. In the end, neither choice is "right or wrong" in an absolute sense, but only with respect to the individuals involved.

18   leo707   2012 Apr 19, 3:52am  

Hysteresis says

i equate low intelligence with low income. sorry if the income part was wrong.

Yeah, what is tina some kind of Einstein?

http://www.youtube.com/embed/ke9iShKzZmM

I equate the idea that intelligence and income are highly correlated with low intelligence.

19   leo707   2012 Apr 19, 3:55am  

bmwman91 says

This is true. Having kids, or not having them, is an intensely personal choice. Both are frought with big compromises. Both can be rationalized and justified. In the end, neither choice is "right or wrong" in an absolute sense, but only with respect to the individuals involved.

Yeah, I agree that it is defiantly an individual thing. I would certainly not advocate that everyone should have kids. Hell, even a lot of people that want them should probably not have them.

Funny thing with the compromises though. With kids I can't do many of the things that I used to love, but I find that I don't really miss them.

20   Hysteresis   2012 Apr 19, 3:56am  

leoj707 says

I equate the idea that intelligence and income are correlated with low intelligence.

well that would be dumb. although not surprising coming from you.

i fear you won't understand the chart below, but others will grasp its meaning

21   tiny tina   2012 Apr 19, 4:01am  

bmwman91 says

Hysteresis says

i equate low intelligence with low income. sorry if the income part was wrong.

LOL....burrrrrrrrrrrrrrnnnnnnnned

Ah, I see we've moved onto 3rd grade and started name calling. Ok. Good job guys.

22   bmwman91   2012 Apr 19, 4:11am  

tiny tina says

Ah, I see we've moved onto 3rd grade and started name calling. Ok. Good job guys.

Oh please. I think that those sentences and vocabulary are more like 6th grade, at least.

23   leo707   2012 Apr 19, 4:13am  

Hysteresis says

i fear you won't understand the chart below, but others will grasp its meaning

I equate the idea that level of education is a good way of determining intelligence with low intelligence.

I guess you think that Bill Gates is an idiot.

24   David9   2012 Apr 19, 4:15am  

tiny tina says

Hysteresis says

tiny tina says

Nope. They're worth way more.

probably why you're poor.

Not sure where you got I'm poor.

And doesn't this count as directly insulting another, violating Patrick's rules?

I'm sure children are price less too you.

Not everyone on the planet shares this view point.

25   bmwman91   2012 Apr 19, 4:45am  

David9 says

I'm sure children are price less too you.

Not everyone on the planet shares this view point.

Children...the 18-25 year STD!

For some reason, it is largely unsurprising that a forum inhabited mostly by housing bears also has a lot of people that don't have kids.

26   freak80   2012 Apr 19, 5:40am  

bmwman91 says

Children...the 18-25 year STD!

And way more expensive too.

27   David9   2012 Apr 19, 5:44am  

bmwman91 says

Children...the 18-25 year STD!

LOL. I was thinking about this at lunch. I have two very tame examples:

1.) My boss and I have discussed how in the past we were chastised, probably discrimintated against, and generally looked down upon because 'no bells ever went off' and we never had children. We are for the most part happy with our lives now.

2.) A younger couple who are friends, a former boss and his wife a Jewish Princess had a baby and bought a house in 2008. The father has confided in me how trapped he is. The Jewish Princess Mother has had nervous breakdowns because 'he is so helpless' Yes, this hurts me because they are my friends.

Some of us are just not hard wired for it.

28   freak80   2012 Apr 19, 5:52am  

bmwman91 says

This is true. Having kids, or not having them, is an intensely personal choice. Both are frought with big compromises. Both can be rationalized and justified. In the end, neither choice is "right or wrong" in an absolute sense, but only with respect to the individuals involved.

Bringing children into this world should be considered an act of cruelty.

29   David9   2012 Apr 19, 6:02am  

wthrfrk80 says

Bringing children into this world should be considered an act of cruelty.

I know of another couple, a man and a woman, who did live in the North East and now reside in the South who have said exactly that.

Another viewpoint of theirs is it should be mandatory, like one of their bulldogs, to go through some evaluation as to whether they are fit parents, not just 'ploop them out' and hope for the best. But they also realize this does not fit in a democracy.

30   bmwman91   2012 Apr 19, 6:05am  

wthrfrk80 says

Bringing children into this world should be considered an act of cruelty.

I sort of agree. It isn't so much that I don't think that I would derive some sort of personal enjoyment form having them, but that the world looks like it is precariously perched on the edge of a major upheaval. If we were to sink into another great depression with soup lines and no ability to provide sufficient food & shelter, it would really tear me up to have to see my kids going to bed hungry and worried.

My mom once told me that, "having kids is your personal affirmation that the world will be a good place." Well.....I try not to give-in to cynicism and negativity, but I genuinely feel that we are rapidly approaching an inflection point in our civilization where the "reset button" is about to be pressed. Unfortunately, my fiancee and I will be a wee bit too old to have kids after that. We have 3-5 years as it is before kids sort of stop becoming an option. Thankfully, we are both in agreement about the kids issue!

31   bmwman91   2012 Apr 19, 6:06am  

David9 says

go through some evaluation as to whether they are fit parents

In theory, it might be a good idea. However, given our current government, I wouldn't trust them to write a manual on how to wipe your own ass...you'd have to wait 3 hours, spend $40 registering, and in the end, you would wind up with poop in your left nostril.

32   David9   2012 Apr 19, 6:10am  

bmwman91 says

David9 says

go through some evaluation as to whether they are fit parents

In theory, it might be a good idea. However, given our current government, I wouldn't trust them to write a manual on how to wipe your own ass...you'd have to wait 3 hours, spend $40 registering, and in the end, you would wind up with poop in your left nostril.

LOL! I just had to agree. Not to mention I don't think we have the funding for it. :-(

33   RealEstateIsBetterThanStocks   2012 Apr 19, 6:14am  

IMO, marriage and kids are high-risk, low-yield investments. a stock that has 50% chance of going down is a stock not worth owning.

34   bmwman91   2012 Apr 19, 6:17am  

Mark D says

marriage and kids are high-risk, low-yield investments. a stock that has 50% chance of going down is a stock not worth owning.

On paper, sure. There are intangibles that, for some, justify it. In the end, we are all still human, and the point of everything we do is to attain happiness. It is hard to quantify that (or impossible). People run into trouble when they blindly make huge choices in life because of social dogmas that promise happiness, and then feel unhappy (when they think that they are supposed to be happy). Happiness requires thought and careful consideration of one's actions, and a good helping of self-honesty (seeing through your own BS). It's easier said than done, though.

35   freak80   2012 Apr 19, 6:21am  

bmwman91 says

the world looks like it is precariously perched on the edge of a major upheaval. If we were to sink into another great depression with soup lines and no ability to provide sufficient food & shelter, it would really tear me up to have to see my kids going to bed hungry and worried.
My mom once told me that, "having kids is your personal affirmation that the world will be a good place." Well.....I try not to give-in to cynicism and negativity, but I genuinely feel that we are rapidly approaching an inflection point in our civilization where the "reset button" is about to be pressed.

Don't forget fossil fuel depletion, global warming, and over-population.

36   freak80   2012 Apr 19, 6:23am  

Mark D says

IMO, marriage and kids are high-risk, low-yield investments. a stock that has 50% chance of going down is a stock not worth owning.

Well put! Especially if you're a guy and she can take 50% of the stuff you own.

How about instead of gay-marriage we just abolish ALL marriage? That sounds like the most sensible thing to do.

37   leo707   2012 Apr 19, 6:25am  

wthrfrk80 says

Don't forget fossil fuel depletion, global warming, and over-population.

Yes, those are huge worries I have for my children's future.

38   David9   2012 Apr 19, 6:25am  

wthrfrk80 says

Don't forget fossil fuel depletion, global warming, and over-population.

Not that those are not valid concerns, but shouldn't it be obvious now the banks, billionaires, and investors don't care about anyone's family? With or without children, btw.

39   freak80   2012 Apr 19, 6:28am  

David9 says

Not that those are not valid concerns, but shouldn't it be obvious now the banks, billionaires, and investors don't care about anyone's family?

When did banks, billionaires, and investors ever care about anything but the bottom line?

Agree. Another good reason to not have children.

40   freak80   2012 Apr 19, 6:29am  

leoj707 says

Yes, those are huge worries I have for my children's future.

Then isn't it a bit irresponsible to have them? We have birth-control and abortion. Use them.

41   David9   2012 Apr 19, 6:34am  

wthrfrk80 says

When did banks, billionaires, and investors ever care about anything but the bottom line?
Agree.

Woo Hoo! Glad somebody got it. (or already knew)

Sad there are so many poorly nourished under loved kids walking around.

Lately, I have seen children under 10 completely unescorted walking about, amazing to me anyway.

42   Vicente   2012 Apr 19, 6:38am  

I fully encourage other people not to procreate. Leaves more room for my descendants, who will be well worth it.

Is there a charity that offers sterilization with a signing bonus? I'd be happy to contribute.

43   bmwman91   2012 Apr 19, 6:40am  

David9 says

Sad there are so many poorly nourished under loved kids walking around.

Oh man....this brings back a funny memory.

Back in college, some of my friends were having a discussion about having kids. They came to the conclusion that it is immoral to have your own kids in our society because there are so many unwanted or uncared-for children out there as it is (you should adopt instead). Well, my buddy Dan's GF was in the other room, and on her period (and she was one of the unlucky ones whose hormones got REALLY out of what at that time). She came bursting out of that room, crying, screaming "well why are we even together then?!?!?!?" My buddy Rob couldn't stifle his snickering, and man, her face got RED and she stormed off.

Then a day or so later she apologized for being crazy. She didn't want kids then, and still isn't there (we all keep in contact). I guess it was just "one of those periods" or something.

44   bmwman91   2012 Apr 19, 6:41am  

Vicente says

Is there a charity that offers sterilization with a signing bonus? I'd be happy to contribute.

Dude, this is my plan to fix America when I am president. $10k, cash, for anyone on welfare that goes in for voluntary sterilization. Inmates that are serving time for non-violent crimes are also eligible. The benefits won't arrive for 12-20 years, but they surely will.

45   leo707   2012 Apr 19, 6:44am  

wthrfrk80 says

leoj707 says

Yes, those are huge worries I have for my children's future.

Then isn't it a bit irresponsible to have them? We have birth-control and abortion. Use them.

Perhaps, but we cannot know the future and we can't live our lives on "what ifs" and "maybes".

What is irresponsible is to have kids then ignore that fossil fuel depletion, global warming, and over-population are issues that they will have to confront in their lives.

Also, it is irresponsible to leave breading it to only the irresponsible. That makes the worries about the future all that more realistic.

46   David9   2012 Apr 19, 6:44am  

bmwman91 says

Dude, this is my plan to fix America when I am president. $10k, cash, for anyone on welfare that goes in for voluntary sterilization. Inmates that are serving time for non-violent crimes are also eligible. The benefits won't arrive for 12-20 years, but they surely will.

That is actually a good plan. Glad I brought back the funny memory.

47   leo707   2012 Apr 19, 6:48am  

bmwman91 says

$10k, cash, for anyone on welfare that goes in for voluntary sterilization. Inmates that are serving time for non-violent crimes are also eligible.

Why stop at welfare and non-violent criminals? It should be an open program.

You could also probably still be effective with it being a lot less; perhaps about the same price as an iPad.

48   freak80   2012 Apr 19, 6:52am  

leoj707 says

Perhaps, but we cannot know the future and we can't live our lives on "what ifs" and "maybes".

Yes we can. 100 years from now all of us will be dead. In the long run, everyone dies.

That alone should be reason enough to not have children.

49   rooemoore   2012 Apr 19, 6:53am  

a lot of fucking worry warts on this site. it reminds me of the "duck and cover days".

Maybe Patrick should have a new logo:

50   leo707   2012 Apr 19, 6:58am  

bmwman91 says

They came to the conclusion that it is immoral to have your own kids in our society because there are so many unwanted or uncared-for children out there as it is (you should adopt instead).

Well, there is a big difference between unwanted and improperly cared for. The idea that there are all these kids that need adopting is a bit of a myth.

People want healthy kids, there are very few kids that are unwanted that do not have serious issues. The demand for healthy adoptable children, especially babies, far outstrips the supply. With westerners willing to drop $30-40k on a third world adoption the results are predictable:
http://www.brandeis.edu/investigate/adoption/GuatemalaNews.html

Adoptions from third world countries are actually often a very immoral choice. Believe it or not even the poor love and want to keep their health babies.

The most moral adoptions are foster-to-adopt programs.

51   David9   2012 Apr 19, 6:58am  

rowemoore says

a lot of f*cking worry warts on this site.

Um, maybe it's because we have been screwed over before and we wish to consciously avoid such behavior and wrong choices.

52   leo707   2012 Apr 19, 6:59am  

rowemoore says

Maybe Patrick should have a new logo:

Why bother, the water will just get spilled anyway.

53   leo707   2012 Apr 19, 7:03am  

wthrfrk80 says

That alone should be reason enough to not have children.

Not have kids because they are going to die?

Why do you continue to choose to live your life?

54   freak80   2012 Apr 19, 7:05am  

leoj707 says

Why do you continue to choose to live your life?

I've been asking myself that question a lot lately.

55   David9   2012 Apr 19, 7:16am  

rowemoore says

I understand your miserable

LOL, actually I am not, but if that is your perception that is ok, after all, you are just a blog stranger on the internet.,

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