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47
Onvacation
2022 Dec 28, 6:51pm
Onvacation
2022 Dec 28, 6:51pm
Hircus says
Yeah, it does.
The neoconservatives would have started this war years ago had Hillary won.
Whether or not russia is at fault / justified / innocent for the war has no bearing here.
Yeah, it does.
The neoconservatives would have started this war years ago had Hillary won.
49
Hircus
2022 Dec 30, 12:45pm
Hircus
2022 Dec 30, 12:45pm
Onvacation says
Please show me where I said that, or explain how you came to the idea that I said / implied / believe that. I'm confused how people could think I hold such positions from this thread.
Here's what I think: I think if you punch someone, you can expect them to punch back, and for an ongoing exchange of punches to follow. Are we not obviously in the midst of war with russia? Is it truly so incredibly far fetched that russia would throw a punch back at us? And yes, I absolutely think we are at war with russia, albeit its a weird one where we often try to strike and oppose each other maximally while sometimes minimizing visibility/accountability of our moves.
Who threw the first punch, or who was justified in punching, or who someone wants side xyz to win is just totally irrelevant to the fact the further punches are to be expected in war. Vlad obviously isnt some little ho who will let the usa/west push him around, yet some people here oddly refuse to consider he may stand up and strike/flex/warn his opposition?
I never said putin=good or putin=bad, and frankly, IMO its just totally besides the point when considering this threads question: discussion of "was it russia?". People should always be able to discuss reality, and getting counter striked in an escalating war is very possible.
I stated why I was making fun of people: some of them seem to have a knee jerk reaction where theyve been programmed to execute Tribalism2022() routine and immediately attempt to oppose, ridicule, smear, and attack anyone who dares to say something which they perceive as being negative about dear vlad, totally missing the forest for the trees in the process by refusing to consider that punches are exchanged in war. Some of the replies are really low quality too, offering little if any justification of their view.
Russia launched dozens (hundreds?) of missiles at ukraine yesterday. Will I now be attacked for acknowledging this? Do I "hate dear vlad" for noticing that he is actually fighting in the war?
Hircus says
I implicated their boyfriend vladimir.
Do you really believe people who oppose our war against Russia love Putin? Do you think Ukraine was not doing corrupt deals with Biden and others in our government before Russia attacked?
Please show me where I said that, or explain how you came to the idea that I said / implied / believe that. I'm confused how people could think I hold such positions from this thread.
Here's what I think: I think if you punch someone, you can expect them to punch back, and for an ongoing exchange of punches to follow. Are we not obviously in the midst of war with russia? Is it truly so incredibly far fetched that russia would throw a punch back at us? And yes, I absolutely think we are at war with russia, albeit its a weird one where we often try to strike and oppose each other maximally while sometimes minimizing visibility/accountability of our moves.
Who threw the first punch, or who was justified in punching, or who someone wants side xyz to win is just totally irrelevant to the fact the further punches are to be expected in war. Vlad obviously isnt some little ho who will let the usa/west push him around, yet some people here oddly refuse to consider he may stand up and strike/flex/warn his opposition?
I never said putin=good or putin=bad, and frankly, IMO its just totally besides the point when considering this threads question: discussion of "was it russia?". People should always be able to discuss reality, and getting counter striked in an escalating war is very possible.
I stated why I was making fun of people: some of them seem to have a knee jerk reaction where theyve been programmed to execute Tribalism2022() routine and immediately attempt to oppose, ridicule, smear, and attack anyone who dares to say something which they perceive as being negative about dear vlad, totally missing the forest for the trees in the process by refusing to consider that punches are exchanged in war. Some of the replies are really low quality too, offering little if any justification of their view.
Russia launched dozens (hundreds?) of missiles at ukraine yesterday. Will I now be attacked for acknowledging this? Do I "hate dear vlad" for noticing that he is actually fighting in the war?
50
richwicks
2022 Dec 30, 1:05pm
richwicks
2022 Dec 30, 1:05pm
Hircus says
Yes, because we've been punching Russia since at least 2000. Don't you realize that?
The Skripal's were OBVIOUSLY not poisoned by Novichok but that didn't stop our propaganda. Russia didn't invade S. Ossetia or start that conflict with Georgia, but our propaganda reported that. They were actually fighting terrorists in Syria, but we were funding them. We overthrew Ukraine, they didn't have a revolution. We exited the SALT treaties, and they abandoned it because we did. THEY blew up oil supply lines going from Syria to Turkey, we encouraged it, we were stealing oil.
We've been the instigators in all this, and by "we" I mean my corrupt, criminal, government.
How has any of this bullshit helped this country in ANY way? How has it helped our allies in Europe in ANY way? As far as I'm concerned our foreign policy is run by traitors working overtime to destroy this country.
Hircus says
None of this would have happened if the US didn't overthrow Ukraine in 2014.
The ideal resolution to this conflict, and the easy resolution, is if Zelenskyy is removed from power, the oligarchs that did this to Ukraine are removed from any power, and that relations between Russia and Europe will be fostered, and NATO will be abandoned. This advantages all parties involved.
All of this would have been avoidable if NATO wasn't constantly expanded and the US puppet leadership in Ukraine just enacted the Minsk Peace Accords. All this could have been trivially avoided, but the maniacs that run the US wanted precisely this.
original link
This is a link to the CEPA paper:
https://cepa.org/article/its-costing-peanuts-for-the-us-to-defeat-russia/
The lunatic sociopaths in power see this war as nothing but a win. They are either stupid, or insane - maybe both and I am fucking tired of these assholes being in power. They had to steal an election to stay in power. Clearly the population is not with them, but you strangely are. How does this help you, your family, your neighbors, anybody? Don't you have the capacity to see the big picture?
You can't recognize that the US started this conflict. It's... perplexing to me. Is it you really don't understand this, or are you deceiving people by pretending you don't understand that? 15 years ago, I thought people like you were just uneducated, but today, I suspect you're malicious and immoral.
Here's what I think: I think if you punch someone, you can expect them to punch back, and for an ongoing exchange of punches to follow. Are we not obviously in the midst of war with russia?
Yes, because we've been punching Russia since at least 2000. Don't you realize that?
The Skripal's were OBVIOUSLY not poisoned by Novichok but that didn't stop our propaganda. Russia didn't invade S. Ossetia or start that conflict with Georgia, but our propaganda reported that. They were actually fighting terrorists in Syria, but we were funding them. We overthrew Ukraine, they didn't have a revolution. We exited the SALT treaties, and they abandoned it because we did. THEY blew up oil supply lines going from Syria to Turkey, we encouraged it, we were stealing oil.
We've been the instigators in all this, and by "we" I mean my corrupt, criminal, government.
How has any of this bullshit helped this country in ANY way? How has it helped our allies in Europe in ANY way? As far as I'm concerned our foreign policy is run by traitors working overtime to destroy this country.
Hircus says
Russia launched dozens (hundreds?) of missiles at ukraine yesterday. Will I now be attacked for acknowledging this? Do I "hate dear vlad" for noticing that he is actually fighting in the war?
None of this would have happened if the US didn't overthrow Ukraine in 2014.
The ideal resolution to this conflict, and the easy resolution, is if Zelenskyy is removed from power, the oligarchs that did this to Ukraine are removed from any power, and that relations between Russia and Europe will be fostered, and NATO will be abandoned. This advantages all parties involved.
All of this would have been avoidable if NATO wasn't constantly expanded and the US puppet leadership in Ukraine just enacted the Minsk Peace Accords. All this could have been trivially avoided, but the maniacs that run the US wanted precisely this.
original link
This is a link to the CEPA paper:
https://cepa.org/article/its-costing-peanuts-for-the-us-to-defeat-russia/
The lunatic sociopaths in power see this war as nothing but a win. They are either stupid, or insane - maybe both and I am fucking tired of these assholes being in power. They had to steal an election to stay in power. Clearly the population is not with them, but you strangely are. How does this help you, your family, your neighbors, anybody? Don't you have the capacity to see the big picture?
You can't recognize that the US started this conflict. It's... perplexing to me. Is it you really don't understand this, or are you deceiving people by pretending you don't understand that? 15 years ago, I thought people like you were just uneducated, but today, I suspect you're malicious and immoral.
51
Onvacation
2022 Dec 30, 1:19pm
Onvacation
2022 Dec 30, 1:19pm
Hircus says
Hircus says
Do you? Trying to understand where you're coming from. You talk like one of those so called "Ukie fluffers".
Not everyone that is against our interfering in Ukraine is Putin's bitch.
I implicated their boyfriend vladimir.
Hircus says
Do I "hate dear vlad" for noticing that he is actually fighting in the war?
Do you? Trying to understand where you're coming from. You talk like one of those so called "Ukie fluffers".
Not everyone that is against our interfering in Ukraine is Putin's bitch.
52
Hircus
2022 Dec 30, 3:03pm
Hircus
2022 Dec 30, 3:03pm
I'm mostly indifferent about Putin. Reason is I don't think I personally know enough about geopolitics to make an decent judgement of him. My impression is I kinda like him, and view him as the underdog fighting goliath, but I know that is superficial. He seems like he loves Russia and wants to see it flourish and preserve their culture, and doesn't want to bend the knee to the mighty west. The west seems to gradually oppose him more and more starting since a bit after he took power. He seems to be trying to reassemble some of the lost soviet power, and the west seems to get scared and want to oppose him in it, and maybe even by tricking/forcing him into wars to make him look bad.
Many people on this forum surely know more about geopol than I do, but I also don't think many, or more likely any, truly know what they're talking about. It's an incredibly complicated and nuanced topic and I'm doubtful many people here or elsewhere actually have the right sources of info to come to accurate conclusions about things such as who is justified in doing xyz, what the true objectives of event abc was, what is the likely result if 123 happens, and so on. I think a lot of stuff goes on behind the scenes and it influences events, but very few people are privy to this critical info that factors into the "why" certain events happen. And I think in this topic in particular, the public has very little insight into the critical behind the scenes info. And I think it's a big problem, but it's also reality. I just don't think you can expect to understand a book if every other word is blanked out. Not that I'm against people doing their best to understand, or having opinions, just saying.
So I somewhat emphasize my interests more towards tangibles.
Onvacation says
Why would you say that? Where did I say or imply anything about support/lack of support/whatever of ukraine means that you're Putin's bitch?
Many people on this forum surely know more about geopol than I do, but I also don't think many, or more likely any, truly know what they're talking about. It's an incredibly complicated and nuanced topic and I'm doubtful many people here or elsewhere actually have the right sources of info to come to accurate conclusions about things such as who is justified in doing xyz, what the true objectives of event abc was, what is the likely result if 123 happens, and so on. I think a lot of stuff goes on behind the scenes and it influences events, but very few people are privy to this critical info that factors into the "why" certain events happen. And I think in this topic in particular, the public has very little insight into the critical behind the scenes info. And I think it's a big problem, but it's also reality. I just don't think you can expect to understand a book if every other word is blanked out. Not that I'm against people doing their best to understand, or having opinions, just saying.
So I somewhat emphasize my interests more towards tangibles.
Onvacation says
Not everyone that is against our interfering in Ukraine is Putin's bitch.
Why would you say that? Where did I say or imply anything about support/lack of support/whatever of ukraine means that you're Putin's bitch?
53
Hircus
2022 Dec 30, 3:04pm
Hircus
2022 Dec 30, 3:04pm
richwicks says
Justify this. Where did I say anything about support / fault / anything about the war?
richwicks says
Again, justify. Where did I address the origins of the war, in any way whatsoever?
Clearly the population is not with them, but you strangely are.
Justify this. Where did I say anything about support / fault / anything about the war?
richwicks says
You can't recognize that the US started this conflict.
Again, justify. Where did I address the origins of the war, in any way whatsoever?
55
richwicks
2022 Dec 30, 8:08pm
richwicks
2022 Dec 30, 8:08pm
Hircus says
OK, perhaps I am wrong, about you.
What is your position on the Ukrainian / Russian conflict? Do you deny that the US overthrew Ukraine? We have absolute proof which I've presented NUMEROUS times. This area is a bastion of corruption of our government, that's the ONLY reason Hunter Biden, a crack addict, and possible pedophile, would be on the BOD of Burisma.
Russia is punching back, against the United States. They are fully aware they are at war with the United States and their NATO proxies.
Our population does NOT support this war, despite the endless propaganda, which I regard as a good thing. Our propaganda system is dissolving, and thank you Mr. Trump. If the media didn't lie about Trump for 4 solid years, there would be full support for this stupid, fucking war, that is just killing people. The result is inevitable, but it will be dragged out because Russia has moved to fighting a war of attrition. I expect this war to go on for years.
Hircus says
Do you understand that the US instigated this war? That this war would NOT have happened if the US didn't overthrow Ukraine?
This is another expensive humanitarian disaster that our "establishment" started, and it began under Obama. If we have a population that is ignorant of this, this will happen again, and again, and again - as it's happened in Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, Somalia, Yemen, and Libya. If Americans refuse to accept that their leadership are complete fuckups, they will never be replaced, stopped, or held to account.
The US is the greatest danger to the world today because of this level of ignorance and incompetence(? maybe malice). We are looking at World War III. Don't you realize that?
richwicks says
Clearly the population is not with them, but you strangely are.
Justify this. Where did I say anything about support / fault / anything about the war?
OK, perhaps I am wrong, about you.
What is your position on the Ukrainian / Russian conflict? Do you deny that the US overthrew Ukraine? We have absolute proof which I've presented NUMEROUS times. This area is a bastion of corruption of our government, that's the ONLY reason Hunter Biden, a crack addict, and possible pedophile, would be on the BOD of Burisma.
Russia is punching back, against the United States. They are fully aware they are at war with the United States and their NATO proxies.
Our population does NOT support this war, despite the endless propaganda, which I regard as a good thing. Our propaganda system is dissolving, and thank you Mr. Trump. If the media didn't lie about Trump for 4 solid years, there would be full support for this stupid, fucking war, that is just killing people. The result is inevitable, but it will be dragged out because Russia has moved to fighting a war of attrition. I expect this war to go on for years.
Hircus says
richwicks says
You can't recognize that the US started this conflict.
Again, justify. Where did I address the origins of the war, in any way whatsoever?
Do you understand that the US instigated this war? That this war would NOT have happened if the US didn't overthrow Ukraine?
This is another expensive humanitarian disaster that our "establishment" started, and it began under Obama. If we have a population that is ignorant of this, this will happen again, and again, and again - as it's happened in Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, Somalia, Yemen, and Libya. If Americans refuse to accept that their leadership are complete fuckups, they will never be replaced, stopped, or held to account.
The US is the greatest danger to the world today because of this level of ignorance and incompetence(? maybe malice). We are looking at World War III. Don't you realize that?
57
Hircus
2022 Dec 31, 8:27am
Hircus
2022 Dec 31, 8:27am
richwicks says
Oh yes, I do!
This is why I'm paying attention to early warning signs of war escalations.
This is why I made this thread to discuss the power grid attacks.
Some people here have become CRAZY tribal. An attempt to discuss a factual event results in a swarm of pattnetters dropping trou and taking huge diarrhea shits on this thread trying to bend it into declarations of putin=good or putin=bad, when it is irrelevant to the topic. Unbelievable.
We are looking at World War III. Don't you realize that?
Oh yes, I do!
This is why I'm paying attention to early warning signs of war escalations.
This is why I made this thread to discuss the power grid attacks.
Some people here have become CRAZY tribal. An attempt to discuss a factual event results in a swarm of pattnetters dropping trou and taking huge diarrhea shits on this thread trying to bend it into declarations of putin=good or putin=bad, when it is irrelevant to the topic. Unbelievable.
58
Hircus
2022 Dec 31, 8:28am
Hircus
2022 Dec 31, 8:28am
Onvacation says
You're a shit poster. You repeatedly try to put words into my mouth and wont address it even when I answer youre own (irrelevant) question.
Hircus says
Are people hallucinating in this thread?
yup
You're a shit poster. You repeatedly try to put words into my mouth and wont address it even when I answer youre own (irrelevant) question.
60
Onvacation
2022 Dec 31, 9:02am
Onvacation
2022 Dec 31, 9:02am
Hircus says
Hircus says
Why would you say that? Where did I say or imply anything about support/lack of support/whatever of ukraine means that you're Putin's bitch?
Hircus says
What I think is funny is the reaction many are having because I implicated their boyfriend vladimir. Maybe they want to ride on his horse? It was caused by anything but my vladi pooh!!! Vlad is a nice guy, and wouldnt ever counter attack his aggressors during a war. No sir. Unpossible. Slurp slurp slurp.
61
Onvacation
2022 Dec 31, 9:08am
Onvacation
2022 Dec 31, 9:08am
Just because I don't support our evil governments war against Russia in Ukraine does not mean I am Putin's "boyfriend".
62
Onvacation
2022 Dec 31, 9:10am
Onvacation
2022 Dec 31, 9:10am
@hircus Do you think we started this war with all of our corruption in Ukraine? Or do you believe Putin attacked unprovoked?
Why do you think we went to war with Russia?
Why do you think we went to war with Russia?
63
richwicks
2022 Dec 31, 9:33am
richwicks
2022 Dec 31, 9:33am
Hircus says
Haha. Remember when "Russia attacked Georgia"?
Dmitry Medvedev was president then. HE ordered Russia in to defend S. Ossetia. Putin was at the Olympics.
People don't even know the situation because our supposed news doesn't report on anything even resembling reality.
Putin is just a Boogeyman. If he stepped down from power or died, there would be no change
The question is if Russia is acting reasonably? The US won't negotiate with Russia, they are openly trying to overthrow the Russian government, they lie constantly to us to try to justify it.. I can damned well tell the US is not acting reasonably.
thread trying to bend it into declarations of putin=good or putin=bad, when it is irrelevant to the topic. Unbelievable
Haha. Remember when "Russia attacked Georgia"?
Dmitry Medvedev was president then. HE ordered Russia in to defend S. Ossetia. Putin was at the Olympics.
People don't even know the situation because our supposed news doesn't report on anything even resembling reality.
Putin is just a Boogeyman. If he stepped down from power or died, there would be no change
The question is if Russia is acting reasonably? The US won't negotiate with Russia, they are openly trying to overthrow the Russian government, they lie constantly to us to try to justify it.. I can damned well tell the US is not acting reasonably.
64
mell
2022 Dec 31, 9:43am
Russia has nothing to gain from petty attacks like these. Sure it could have been immigrants from any nation trying to stick it to the US of A, but highly unlikely they were acting on behalf of their government if so. More likely a local disgruntled person, or somebody just messing with the system to feel a sense of power. Either way, imo the lesson from that is that who it was is irrelevant, what's relevant is that the US should spend the few $$ they don't have (but print) on their own infrastructure, beefing up security and reliability, instead of sending billions to a corrupt regime.
65
AmericanKulak
2022 Dec 31, 11:56am
AmericanKulak
2022 Dec 31, 11:56am
mell says
mell says
Hircus says
Probably Anarchists, or Fedarchists.
It's pretty clear they're deliberately creating an energy shortage.
Russia has nothing to gain from petty attacks like these. Sure it could have been immigrants from any nation trying to stick it to the US of A, but highly unlikely they were acting on behalf of their government if so. More likely a local disgruntled person, or somebody just messing with the system to feel a sense of power. Either way, imo the lesson from that is that who it was is irrelevant, what's relevant is that the US should spend the few $$ they don't have (but print) on their own infrastructure, beefing up security and reliability, instead of sending billions to a corrupt regime.
mell says
Russia has nothing to gain from petty attacks like these. Sure it could have been immigrants from any nation trying to stick it to the US of A, but highly unlikely they were acting on behalf of their government if so. More likely a local disgruntled person, or somebody just messing with the system to feel a sense of power. Either way, imo the lesson from that is that who it was is irrelevant, what's relevant is that the US should spend the few $$ they don't have (but print) on their own infrastructure, beefing up security and reliability, instead of sending billions to a corrupt regime.
Hircus says
I never said putin=good or putin=bad, and frankly, IMO its just totally besides the point when considering this threads question: discussion of "was it russia?". People should always be able to discuss reality, and getting counter striked in an escalating war is very possible.
Probably Anarchists, or Fedarchists.
It's pretty clear they're deliberately creating an energy shortage.
67
AmericanKulak
2023 Jan 4, 7:52pm
AmericanKulak
2023 Jan 4, 7:52pm
Suspects targetted the power grid to facilitate a burglary.
https://www.zerohedge.com/energy/two-charged-christmas-day-attacks-washington-power-grid
https://www.zerohedge.com/energy/two-charged-christmas-day-attacks-washington-power-grid
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I think it's odd that "ukraine" did drone strikes deep into russia a couple days later. I thought up until now, they had mostly refrained from attacking russia beyond their borders, so them doing such a move marks an escalation. Could be coincidence, but I think this might be the evolution of our weird proxy war, where we werent "officially" at war w/ russia, but in reality we are. They showed us that we can be touched deep in our mainland, so we showed them the same.
I think some months back in this year I read that there was unusual drone activity near US resources, like power plants and electric substations. Seems to me an enemy could do serious damage to us by attacking our infrastructure from within our own country. Strap a bomb to a drone and fly it into infrastructure. They dont even need to have a person nearby to visually fly it - they can easily control drones remotely via long range directed wifi or lte connection, making it really hard for their agent who places the drone on the ground to get caught.
But a bomb on a drone is more state-actor style, and obvious. This current attack was bullets, which conveniently allows the usa to blame it as a one off angry employee, even if they know it wasnt. Bullets do not force the us to declare war on russia. This attack was probably in response to something we recently did, and IMO a move like this seems like a warning designed to make us tread more carefully. A snake rattling its tail before a strike.
Of course I'm just speculating here. Sure, it could have been a disgruntled employee who knew what things to shoot at to cause a 3-5 day power outage in winter. Or maybe even a rando just shot stuff and got lucky to hit critical things. But media says the shooter knew what they were doing, although they have no suspects and no motive to report. I dont think these types of attacks are common, and the timing is very suspect IMO. They've been talking about how crazy vulnerable our electric grid is for decades now. It's a glass house.