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I have to legally sell 30 doses of sealed 150mg Lovenox that expires on 1/18 (expensive drug)

By iwog   Jun 17, 2:00pm   2 links   1,305 views   25 comments   watch (0)   quote      

Just throwing that out there.

Comments 1-25 of 25     Last »

1   HEY YOU   Jun 17, 4:33pm     ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote    

Drug dealer! lol

2   Ceffer   Jun 17, 5:57pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Do you have any Love Knocks in your trench coat?

3   BayAreaObserver   Jun 17, 6:01pm     ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike   quote    

You probably can not "legally" sell the stuff Iwog. Your best bet would be to see if the pharmacy you got them from will take them back however...

CPG Sec. 460.300 Return of Unused Prescription Drugs to Pharmacy Stock.

POLICY: A pharmacist should not return drugs products to his stock once they have been out of his possession. It could be a dangerous practice for pharmacists to accept and return to stock the unused portions of prescriptions that are returned by patrons, because he would no longer have any assurance of the strength, quality, purity or identity of the articles.

https://www.fda.gov/ICECI/ComplianceManuals/CompliancePolicyGuidanceManual/ucm074399.htm

State Prescription Drug Return, Reuse and Recycling Laws

http://www.ncsl.org/research/health/state-prescription-drug-return-reuse-and-recycling.aspx

Kind of think you may end up eating the loss and taking them to your local police station or other appropriate disposal location.

4   HEY YOU   Jun 17, 9:57pm     ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote    

I don't need any of them.
"I high on life."

5   BayAreaObserver   Jun 18, 4:09am     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Iwog - have you considered the "liability" problems concerning this as well ? Just on that issue alone would stop me from considering any thing like this. Not talking about the police, more if something went awry after someone were to purchase your medications.

Knowing what a ligation happy country we live in tells me it just isn't worth the risk or whatever small amount of money is involved as opposed to having to retain counsel to defend yourself from something.

6   jazz_music   Jun 18, 11:38am     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Hmmm.

Enoxaparin sodium, sold under the brand name Lovenox among others, is an anticoagulant medication. It is used to treat and prevent deep vein thrombosis and pulmonary embolism including during pregnancy and following certain types of surgery. It is also used in those with acute coronary syndrome and heart attacks. It is given by injection just under the skin or into a vein. Other uses include inside kidney dialysis machines.

7   iwog   Jun 18, 12:09pm     ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote    

BayAreaObserver says

Iwog - have you considered the "liability" problems concerning this as well ?

iwog says

I have to legally sell 30 doses of sealed 150mg Lovenox

I think it's immoral that thousands of people desperately need this drug but can't take it because they can't afford the extremely high cost.

I would consider throwing it away to be an atrocity.

8   PeopleUnited   Jun 18, 8:13pm     ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote    

eBay started by selling Pez dispensers, Maybe PatNet's claim to fame will become illegal sales of prescription medications.

9   Ceffer   Jun 18, 8:57pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Do you have your malpractice policy up to date, in case whoever receives and takes the medicine has an adverse reaction?

10   BlueSardine   Jun 18, 9:16pm     ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote    

iwog appears to be an underground narc hellbent on outing the pill peddlers on the net...
interact with at your own risk...

11   BayAreaObserver   Jun 19, 4:24am     ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote    

Iwog - you may consider throwing away the unused drugs an atrocity or worse however I would like to see the statute or guidelines that cause you to believe you have a "legal" ground to sell this unused prescription.

If you want to get upset, try the FDA and the American Bar Association along with the various state bar associations.

So far I have yet to find anything that states what you want to do is "legal" however there is no shortage of information out there that what you are trying to do is completely illegal and personally I am kind of surprised Patrick is letting this stay up. I would think a really good attorney could go after Patrick for complicity.

For what it's worth you are not alone in having to dispose of unused drugs including those prescribed by a veterinarian which are very expensive and with that being said - would you trust someone you never met or even if you did to buy and then consume a prescription drug that may or not be what the seller says it is ?

Would you take the Rx or let a family member take it and no, we are not talking 3rd world here, obviously you can afford the Rx or your insurance could. Speaking on insurance did this Rx get partially paid by insurance or was this out of pocket 100% ?

12   BlueSardine   Jun 19, 5:11am     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

This is rather obvious, which leads me to conclude ..

https://patrick.net/1307352/2017-06-17-i-have-to-legally-sell-30-doses-of-sealed-150mg-lovenox-that-expires-on-1-18-expensive-drug?c=1420344#comment-1420344

BayAreaObserver says

I would like to see the statute or guidelines that cause you to believe you have a "legal" ground to sell this unused prescription.

13   BlueSardine   Jun 19, 5:13am     ↑ like (3)   ↓ dislike   quote    

Is iwog driving a suicide bus into patrick.net due to various slap downs and being galactically wrong on the big issues?

BayAreaObserver says

I am kind of surprised Patrick is letting this stay up. I would think a really good attorney could go after Patrick for complicity.

14   Ceffer   Jun 22, 11:55am     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Bottom line, you cannot legally or ethically become a "reseller" of any prescribed drug. Even if the drug can be demonstrated to be untampered (the assumption being that a prescribed drug in the care, custody and control of and end user is by definition no longer untampered), then the "reseller" is assuming the responsibilities of a licensed prescribing entity "doctor" and a licensed selling entity "pharmacist" for whatever consequences may befall the new end user.

The hypothetical price or value of the medicine is irrelevant. Either find a way of appropriately disposing of it, or take it back to a pharmacist and let him decide what to do with it.

15   justme   Jun 22, 12:20pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

I have two sets of epi-pens that (still) are very costly and I'm bummed that I can't give them away without possibly facing liability or maybe even prosecution. There ought to be a "good samaritan" law that allowed people to donate their unused medications to those in need without having to worry.

16   curious2   Jun 22, 12:47pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

justme says

There ought to be

a repeal of the Rx requirement. It adds costs without commensurate benefit. Its purpose and effect are to maximize spending, and it operates as designed, as you have experienced.

BayAreaObserver says

would you trust someone you never met

I've never met most pharmacists. I've read of lethal pharmacy errors, and I've seen pharmacy errors, and "errors" like placing a sticker over an expiration date. I might trust someone who uses his real name and can tell me the chain of custody and storage conditions. The current mandatory Rx system enables a lot of hidden abuse, including expired or overheated drugs, and unwanted substitutions by mistake or "mistake".

17   Booger   Jun 22, 1:30pm     ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike   quote    

iwog says

I think it's immoral that thousands of people desperately need this drug but can't take it because they can't afford the extremely high cost.

I would consider throwing it away to be an atrocity.

I agree, but you are probably going to have to give them away to be legal.

18   BayAreaObserver   Jun 22, 3:20pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

curious2 - I am not keen to purchase anything like Prescription Meds and a host of other things from people who are selling on the Net or similar and actually I won't or wouldn't.

At least with a brick and mortar pharmacy if something goes wrong, you have some recourse. Same with most reputable mail order prescription pharmacies.

Then again I am notoriously cheap and keep my old Rxs forever and a day and they do not lose that much effectiveness past the expiration date to render them completely useless.

In Iwog's case he has not been under treatment for the Deep Vein Thrombosis that long, I remember when he first posted about it. If it's me, rather that getting melodramatic about the horrors of not being able to sell or give the stuff away I would tend to hold on to the stuff - just in case, but that's me - doesn't work for everyone.

If he is still going to the Philippines, I am sure without any shadow of a doubt he can unload them there in a heartbeat or less.

19   curious2   Jun 22, 3:25pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

BayAreaObserver says

they do not lose that much

Some, e.g. doxycycline, can turn toxic. IMMV. Storage conditions, including especially temperature, can make a big difference. Meds stored in a refrigerator or cool basement can last a lot longer than in if kept in a warm storage room with ventilation windows that let in the sun.

BTW, USA is the only country I know of that requires you to buy individually decanted pills, not even in the manufacturer's packaging. Generics can vary a lot, and most people don't even know who made them. Seriously, people have died from brick&mortar pharmacy errors. The USA has the most expensive medical system on earth, and it is chronically unreliable: most people don't know what they're getting.

20   SpecialSnowflake   Jun 22, 3:33pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

Drive to Tijuana and unload them there.

21   BayAreaObserver   Jun 22, 3:58pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

curious2 - Not denying anything that you have stated. Some medications do not turn toxic and I have had this discussion with several physicians over the years who reluctantly admitted the Rx I was using at the time was okay to use even after the expiration date - way after.

In South Korea when you get one or more prescriptions, most of the time I have seen them dispensed in a strip of individual tear off packages that contain the dose(s) for each day - no manufacturers packaging. Makes it fairly convenient so you know what you are supposed to take each day.

When my dog died in February of 2016, I had to eat a lot of costs for unused Medications. Some were human medications for Asthma etc. I had to buy from a Canadian Pharmacy because the cost was so high here and I did not have pet insurance to help cover those costs. Prior to her death I became suspect of one inhaler and stopped using it. Turns out the inhaler was okay, the dog was wasn't responding anymore. You can not legally do not anything with pet prescriptions either and the vet here wouldn't take them back. Not sure if the shelters would even take them - it all comes down to liability concerns.

If someone can not read the storage or use instructions or is too lazy to do so, that sounds to me like a strictly personal problem and the same goes with not staying in constant contact with your physician while you are taking the stuff to discuss side effects etc.

Sometimes you eat the bear and sometimes the bear eats you.....

22   Quigley   Jun 22, 4:07pm     ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote    

You can legally buy prescription antibiotics for your dog on the web if it's for fish. Same exact stuff packaged with a fish on the bottle.

23   curious2   Jun 22, 4:16pm     ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote    

Certainly some drugs can store a very long time if stored correctly, which is why I mentioned a refrigerator or cool basement.

BayAreaObserver says

staying in constant contact with your physician...

sounds really high maintenance to me, and very expensive. Most physicians don't have that much time for one patient, unless maybe a really lucrative patient like Michael Jackson, and look how that worked out. Many doctors can get misled by drug marketers, e.g. the Oxycontin fraud where doctors were told specifically that it was not habit forming. I've seen doctors deny adamantly the existence of side effects that are widely documented, after marketers had assured them and smiled and maybe given them a pen or a pizza or consulting payment.

Your life depends on your house, but that doesn't stop people from doing their own maintenance. Same with cars, though cars on public roads must pass inspection.

I have a visceral reaction against mandatory dependence, borrowing & spending, etc. It seems very unhealthy to me, usually presented by advertisers and lobbyists representing their clients' interests at the expense of everyone else.

24   BayAreaObserver   Jun 22, 4:16pm     ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike   quote    

Quigley - thanks for the update. The stuff I was using unfortunately wasn't in that category. The first Rx came from Costco and when I went to pick it up, I could see what I thought was $19.99 and thought wow, the vet was just embellishing the cost. The actual cost was $199.99 and I got that one and then got another prescription (required even for the Canadian Pharmacy) to get the cost under $50.

The dog actually had an Rx record at the Pharmacy in California, Costco here and in Canada since most of the stuff was human meds. The vet in California used the local pharmacy to fill stuff for pets since the cost was so much less than the same thing but for pets. There is a huge markup on medications for pets just because they can.

On a side note - they do make inhalers for pets, they are basically the same as one's for infants and I got lucky in that my dog knew to use it since it helped her.

25   BayAreaObserver   Jun 22, 5:33pm     ↑ like   ↓ dislike   quote    

curious2 - on staying in contact with the doctor - since 2008 I have used the internet to talk back and forth with them. They actually encourage it and unless you have a life threatening situation, it's the way to go. The vast majority of the time I have gotten a response the same day, always within 24 hours.

I have discussed dosage amounts, if something is or isn't a side effect - pretty much everything. The one huge revelation came by accident during what was a rather mundane boring office visit. There was a point when I was quite sick and for about six months the checkups were on a monthly basis, mostly just very short visits.

As I was getting ready to leave, I mentioned to the doctor about nodding off frequently during the day and the doctor pulled me back in and we had a long discussion and I ended up in a sleep study etc. and was diagnosed with severe obstructive sleep apnea. The thought of that had never crossed my mind and I was attributing my sudden bursts of falling asleep (even while driving) on a host of other things but not that.

Anyway - I guess expensive is in the eye of the beholder. I make a strong effort to interact with the doctors and ask a lot of questions and if I forget something or still have questions, I go to the internet and 99% of my problems are resolved that way. I have never been charged a fee for talking with any of them thru the on line contact with the office.

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