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America, you just got pwned


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2008 Oct 3, 3:56am   36,141 views  193 comments

by SP   ➕follow (0)   💰tip   ignore  

pawn shop

The House of Representatives approved a $700 billion bailout package for U.S. banksters.

The fundamental problems with the bill remain intact.

  • Paulson gets to decide what dirty toilet paper to buy with taxpayer dollars, and how much to pay. He will be "overseen" by a toothless oversight committee that is stacked with the bankster cronies.
  • The "700 Billion" figure is false - it is still a revolving credit line and Paulson gets to blow as much taxpayer money as he can get away with by running up 700 Billion at a time.
  • The bill still allows foreign banks to unload their craptastic debt on to the US taxpayer at Paulson's discretion.
  • The bill has NO procedural details on exactly how these purchases are valued, or how they will be sold.
  • There is no regulation that ensures that the taxpayer's money has even a chance of being returned, let alone profitably.
  • AND, here is the curdled-cream topping on this shit-sandwich - none of this is going to diddley squat for the economy - it is still going into the shitter, circling the drain. The only difference now is that Paulson and his friends have managed to stick the hook into the taxpayer's neck for all the excessive risk in their speculation.
  • Argentina, feel free to cry.

    SP

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    127   PermaRenter   2008 Oct 5, 1:57am  

    Explaining the consequences of the Wall Street disintegration, Rockefeller emphasized “I absolutely share your anger and frustration. We should not be in this situation. [But] failure to act will severely hurt West Virginia families and that is a risk I am not willing to take.”

    Ironically, a 90-year-old Akron, Ohio, woman’s failed suicide attempt over her home foreclosure was mentioned in a Congressional speech before passage.

    Addie Polk attempted to kill herself with a self-inflicted gunshot as deputies knocked at the door at least the 31st time to serve her with an eviction notice. Ms. Polk fell behind on the mortgage on the house she lived in for 38 years apparently due to predatory lending practices. Often, home buyers have adjustable rate mortgage rates and they cannot keep up with the rising interest rates or did not understand that their payments would rise.

    “This bill does nothing for the Addie Polks of the world,” states Rep. Dennis Kucinich (D-Ohio) during House debate Friday, Oct. 3.

    Polk has been taken to a hospital suffering from a wound to her shoulder. Her condition has been described as “critical” by a member of Akron’s City Council. Late Friday afternoon, a spokesman for Fannie Mae announced that they would “forgive whatever outstanding balance she had on the loan and give her the house.”

    128   PermaRenter   2008 Oct 5, 1:58am  

    90 year old Addie Polk, of Akron, Ohio, Is becoming the symbol of the home mortgage crisis. She attempted to kill herself when the Sheriff came to evict her from her home. A home she has lived in since 1970. Public records indicate the tragedy was more a consequence of predatory lenders then 90 year old Addie’s want to live large on credit with no means to repay.

    It began in1997 when she started borrowing on her home to make ends meet, a home that was first paid off in1982…What Addie may have needed was a senior reverse mortgage. For those who haven’t seen Robert Wagner or Jim Garners senior reverse mortgage commercials. It’s a loan that allows the lender to give a homeowner 62 years or older government backed access to all the equity in their home without having to worry about making monthly payments. Depending on individual needs seniors can take a lump sum or receive monthly payments and the loan is paid off only after the senior dies and the estate is settled.

    Since Addie has remortgaged her home three times since 97 and the market only kept going up from 97 till her last loan with country wide in 2004, I would have to agree with others in the press who initially suspect Addie may have been the victim of predatory loan agents. But in a happy note Fannie Mae spokesman Brian Faith announced the mortgage association had decided to halt action against Polk and sign the property “outright” to her after her plight was brought up in the United States congress. “We’re going to forgive whatever outstanding balance she had on the loan and give her the house,” Faith said. “Given the circumstances, we think it’s appropriate.”

    Residents of Akron have also rallied behind Polk, who is being treated at Akron General Medical Center. She was listed in critical condition Friday afternoon having shot herself twice, according to Akron City Council President Marco Sommerville. And double kudos’s to U.S. Rep. Dennis Kucinich, D-Ohio, who mentioned Polk on the House floor Friday during debate over the rescue proposal.”This bill does nothing for the Addie Polk’s of the world,” Kucinich said after telling her story. “This bill fails to address the fact that millions of homeowners are facing foreclosure, are facing the loss of their home. This bill will take care of Wall Street, and the market may go up for a few days, but democracy is going downhill.”

    129   PermaRenter   2008 Oct 5, 2:01am  

    Want your mortgage forgiven? Shoot yourself

    I think it's beyond obvious that this is the wrong way to deal with this tragedy and will inspire copycats and general mayhem. Lots of people will shoot themselves if it means their mortgage balance will be wiped out.

    (CNN) -- Fannie Mae said it will set aside the loan of a woman who shot herself as sheriff's deputies tried to evict her from her foreclosed home.

    Fannie Mae foreclosed on the Akron, Ohio, home of Addie Polk, 90, after acquiring the mortgage in 2007.

    Polk became a symbol of the nation's home mortgage crisis when she was hospitalized after shooting herself at least twice in the upper body Wednesday afternoon.

    On Friday, Fannie Mae spokesman Brian Faith said the mortgage association had decided to halt action against Polk and sign the property "outright" to her.

    "We're going to forgive whatever outstanding balance she had on the loan and give her the house," Faith said. "Given the circumstances, we think it's appropriate."

    130   PermaRenter   2008 Oct 5, 2:05am  

    My question is if she wanted to kill herself, there are surer ways of doing it. I think she wanted to survive shooting. In other words suicide intent is suspect.

    131   PermaRenter   2008 Oct 5, 2:13am  

    Obama worked as a Lawyer for Acorn, Acorn forced banks to give risky loans to uncreditworthy people with no money down, ie no vested interest. People with no real vested interest buy property increasing the price of real estate creating the housing bubble, and while artifially inflating the value of real estate which also increased your property tax. The republicans fought over and over for more regulation and oversight, but Andrew Mozillo, Countrywide/ Raines & Johnson of Fannie Mae along with their Counterparts and reciepients of the largest campaign contributions who are supposed to work for you the people not Fannie Mae, Barney Frank, Chris Dodd, in fact all the Democratic Memebers of Congress voted against it. So Fannie sells these worthless mortgages to the Stock market and now we have a Crisis. The bad loans that should not have been made are being forclosed on and those foreclosures have now driven down the value of your property. Who wins Jim Johnson/Franklin Raines who made millions from Fannie Mae & The recipients of campaign contribushions , Dodd , Obama, Frank, Angelo Mozilo owner of Countrywide who did his bailout by selling his stock before things really got bad THEY SHOULD ALL BE IN PRISON. Who are the losers, You the American Taxpayer who has to pay for the Bailout that the Dems not only rushed to push through, (Jeez they wanted to help a Lame Duck Republican President) Quickly .We can blame it on Wall Street Greed like any one who buys an investment they bought it in droves because they were led to believe it was sound. And now your Retirement Fund your 401K is not worth S***, So when you open your earnings report and go to vote in Nov. remember who got you into this mess.

    132   justme   2008 Oct 5, 2:34am  

    I haven't yet seen any MSM stories about the reported (on this blog) 200B Chinese purchase of treasury debt. IS there anything out?

    133   justme   2008 Oct 5, 2:49am  

    Permarenter,

    I agree. The Addie Polk story does not add up. She is already home from the hospital after less than 2 days? She shot herself "in the shoulder" while lying in bed. And she is 90 years old?

    It sounds like a very superficial injury, inflicted to get attention and sympathy, quite frankly. That is my initial guess. I'd like to get more details before deciding for certain. I just think it sounds suspect.

    In any case, I think that FNM should not have acted so hastily in forgiving the loan. FNM's actions may indeed cause a rash of fake and real shootings.

    134   slumlord   2008 Oct 5, 2:52am  

    The problem is not the housing bubble. Which is a natural reaction to low interest rates.
    The problem is the reaction to the bubble popping, which is what we are seeing with the gov taking our money and giving it to the bankers.
    You either believe in free markets or you do not...

    135   justme   2008 Oct 5, 2:55am  

    Over on Bigpicture blog: Did JPM Cash Call Bring Down Lehman ?

    It is becoming more and more clear that that the non-rescue of Lehman is at the epicenter of the financial crisis, and indeed also the main event that lead up to creating of the 700B bailout fund.

    No way shorting of the financial 799+ will be allowed again on Wed at 24:00.

    136   snmr   2008 Oct 5, 4:50am  

    permarenter wrote :


    Obama worked as a Lawyer for Acorn, Acorn forced banks to give risky loans to uncreditworthy people with no money down, ie no vested interest.

    Do you have any reference to any rule which forces banks to give loans to uncreditworthy people.

    Fannie mai/mac were there for many years . Did something suddenly change recently ( 2000 +) that it caused a bubble ?

    I am not saying that you are wrong in your assertions but more info would certainly help.

    137   HeadSet   2008 Oct 5, 5:26am  

    I personally pledge $100 to anyone running against each of the 263 “members” (pun intended) of congress, and the 74 sphincters from the senate.

    Well, you can save some money here. These two have outraged thier constituents by voting for the Senate bailout bill, an act that is expected to cost them re-election.

    Chambliss, Saxby R-Ga.
    McConnell, Mitch R - Ky

    I don't know if any Democrats who voted "yes" will be hurt. Ironic though, that the Dems may gain a 60 seat majority in the Senate after Nov, in no small part to Republicans not being re-elected because they voted for the bill.

    138   PermaRenter   2008 Oct 5, 5:34am  

    BBC business editor Robert Peston says the German decision is momentous, and that all other EU countries - including the UK - will almost certainly follow suit.

    "We tell all savings account holders that your deposits are safe. The federal government assures it," Ms Merkel said.

    "We will not allow the distress of one financial institution to distress the entire system. For that reason, we are working hard to secure Hypo Real Estate."
    ...
    Finance Minister Peer Steinbrueck said he was "appalled" that the problems at Hypo had not been revealed earlier.
    ...
    On Saturday, leaders of the major European economies met in Paris for talks hosted by French President Nicolas Sarkozy.

    Britain, Germany, Italy and France all agreed to work together to support financial institutions - but stopped short of agreeing US-style bank bail-out plan.

    Just ten days ago, citing Anglo-Saxon greed and poor regulation, German finance minister Peer Steinbrueck said the U.S. was in the process of losing its "superpower status" due to the financial crisis that we Americans caused.

    139   HeadSet   2008 Oct 5, 5:57am  

    Yep, Europe is following us. Expect that German bank bailout to eventually hit around 100 billion Euros. Look for more bank bailouts to come along in France, Britain, Belgium, and Iceland. Huge bailouts, especially considering the relative sizes of their economies.

    Real estate may be local, but if real estate prices correct in the USA they will correct world-wide. Same results - banks fail on non-performing loans, stock values fall, nervous gov does bailout.

    140   HeadSet   2008 Oct 5, 6:10am  

    Peer Steinbrueck said the U.S. was in the process of losing its “superpower status”

    EuroPuds have been making that claim as early as 1965. I suspect we will still be hearing it in 2065.

    “We tell all savings account holders that your deposits are safe. The federal government assures it,” Ms Merkel said.

    The German version of FDIC (although more private) is only about $35k insured, and then only for 90% of the deposit, and not supported at all banks. This is why Reich Chancellor Merkle had to make that policy.

    141   Brand165   2008 Oct 5, 7:02am  

    * Free house may be in Detroit or Akron.

    142   KurtS   2008 Oct 5, 9:26am  

    "the U.S. was in the process of losing its “superpower status” due to the financial crisis that we Americans caused."

    Pure BS, but many Euros will believe it. Europe was also living it up on the credit bubble--both in real estate and retail spending. It might not be the complete credit clusterf*ck that many American did to themselves, but there are many parallels. The UK shouldn't blame their mess on us either.

    143   OO   2008 Oct 5, 9:55am  

    The US is losing it superpower status, we cannot maintain such a large military presence in the world any more. Either we send the old folks to gas chambers, or we cut our military expenditure.

    Oh, raising the marginal tax rate to 80%? Aren't you aware that over 50% of the tax of this country is being paid by 5% of the population, and this 5% has a rather high international mobility when it comes to choice of abode? The most mobile population in the US are those making the highest income, and don't count on their patriotism to pay tax.

    Something has to give.

    144   OO   2008 Oct 5, 10:00am  

    The loss of US' superpower status doesn't mean that Europe is going to come fill the void, nobody can.

    It just means that the world will be again unstable, each region with only regional superpowers, and there will be a new age Cold War. I am ok with cold war as long as it doesn't turn hot. The US got a lot of things done during the Cold War, an enemy keeps you alert and on focus, you don't get your country buy property in droves on negative amortization if you are constantly under the risk of a military attack. You will do something useful for yourself and the human civilization.

    145   Jimbo   2008 Oct 5, 10:56am  

    Sorry PermaRenter, American's aren't buying the GOP bucket o' BS anymore, go peddle your fables somewhere else.

    146   Jimbo   2008 Oct 5, 10:57am  

    If you want a good analysis of what really happened in the financial system, which was mostly a failure of regulation, check out this blog:

    http://economistsview.typepad.com/economistsview/2008/10/barry-ritholtz.html

    147   cb   2008 Oct 5, 11:20am  

    Asian market down big, now that the all the "good news" are out, what's left to rally the market?

    Incidentally, I check the CIBC (a Cdn bank) website, 3 year GIC over $10000 pays about 4% interests. You can also buy them in a number of foreign currency (just don't pick the USD) :)

    148   OO   2008 Oct 5, 11:37am  

    I think we may have an emergency rate cut.

    149   PermaRenter   2008 Oct 5, 11:48am  

    >> Sorry PermaRenter, American’s aren’t buying the GOP bucket

    Majority of DEMs voted for bailout -- how can I vote for DEM in November?

    150   Lost Cause   2008 Oct 5, 12:23pm  

    Yep, Europe is following us. Expect that German bank bailout to eventually hit around 100 billion Euros.

    It's worldwide -- 24 hour party people!

    I have never been so disgusted.

    151   OO   2008 Oct 5, 12:54pm  

    PermaRenter,

    vote for Fiorina instead, she will make sure that you get outsourced as well.

    But at this stage, I think it doesn't matter. I will probably outsource myself voluntarily. Seriously, if you are worried about illegal or legal immigrants threatening your job prospect, you probably are not that up the ladder anyway and you are stuck here in the US no matter what.

    One should always aspire to be a global citizen to migrate to whichever country that serves his best interest at the moment. Therefore I am all for immigration in all countries so that I can pick and choose which one to go to. In fact, most immigrants bring money and skill the host countries lack at a fairly low cost. I am not the type that wants to shut the door once I am in, because where I am right now may be rotten in a few years and I don't want the other countries to shut the door on me, even if I bring enough to the table.

    152   OO   2008 Oct 5, 1:32pm  

    TOB,

    news for you, the American elites are precisely this attitude. You don't think the American elites will stick around to bear the consequences do you?

    153   danville woman   2008 Oct 5, 1:41pm  

    Just heard that Vanguard is being cagey about how they insure their mutual funds - apparently they are insured "privately"

    Anyone know if their Treasury Money Market Funds are totally safe and if buying Treasuries through their brokerage is totally safe.

    Maybe I should be buying treasuries directly from the government.

    154   OO   2008 Oct 5, 1:50pm  

    TOB,

    see what the elites are getting away with? More money and even more power. See, what the working class Americans hate or not hate doesn't make any difference, and I doubt if they care either way. They are busy watching American Idol.

    Only the people who aspire to become American Elite but failed will understand what a raw deal they ended up with, and get pissed.

    155   coretexity   2008 Oct 5, 2:06pm  

    400,000 fucking deadbeats will get to stay in their houses.

    http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/081006/clm041.html?.v=101

    156   Unalloyed   2008 Oct 5, 2:32pm  

    @danville woman

    You can do it without paying any intermediary or broker and it is easy. Go to www.treasurydirect.gov and set up an account. When you set up the account you them a checking account number. Say you want to put about $50,000.00 into a 6 month treasury bill. You make sure you have 50K in your account before you request to buy. The Treasury will debit an amount a little less than 50K (assuming non-zero rates by the time you do it) from your checking about 3 days after the Monday auction. 6 months after you make your purchase the Treasury will deposit $50K back into your checking. Read the online help first. It is very accessible. There is nothing difficult about buying your own treasury securities. I have moved about 40% of my portfolio into laddered short term treasury bills. I am not saying it is a good investment. I am just saying you don't have to pay anybody to buy them on your behalf. Disclaimer: All of the above is not investment advice. Please seek the counsel of a competent financial advisor and be careful.

    157   coretexity   2008 Oct 5, 2:40pm  

    TOB - Regarding the numbers, they seriously need to ban L1. It has no limits and now has some sort of a loophole (water cooler talk, no details) which lets the L1s become permanent residents in a record amount of time. So basically you do not need a technical/scientific background, there is no labor cert, there is no cap, the wifey can legally work, and now this loophole. Even H1Bs are screwed by them.

    I am all in favor of H1B *but* with strict education, employment and skill-set verification plus no middlemen (read Indian Bodyshoppers). However, existence of L1 is beyond me.

    158   coretexity   2008 Oct 5, 2:52pm  

    Yes mike_orange. L1 is the NINJA Subprime of the legal immigration world.

    159   Brand165   2008 Oct 5, 3:08pm  

    cortexity: Those L1 NINJAs will need an immediate bailout to ensure their continued dream of American citizenship! They were victims of predatory citizenship practices... and who can blame them for wanting to remain in their beautiful new home?

    160   coretexity   2008 Oct 5, 3:41pm  

    There will be no middle class pretty soon IMO.

    161   Zephyr   2008 Oct 5, 3:44pm  

    No matter how you slice it we compete with the world. We can bring the cheap labor here to make our businesses more competitive, or the business will go to the countries where the cheap labor resides.

    It is not so much a question of who will do the work as it is where they will do it.

    162   Zephyr   2008 Oct 5, 3:45pm  

    If we bring the labor here, at least their earnings will be spent here.

    163   coretexity   2008 Oct 5, 3:53pm  

    mike_orange - I do not think I'd go this far in the tech workers. Remember, if it were not for these idiots making 120k and buying 1M houses, bay area real estate would be similar to Stockton.

    164   coretexity   2008 Oct 5, 3:54pm  

    in the tech workers = in *dissing* the tech workers.

    165   Zephyr   2008 Oct 5, 3:56pm  

    "Can we have a middle class party instead of rich mans party (republican) and poor man’s party ( Democratic) ??"

    No. Both parties are for the rich, and mostly controlled by the rich. And any party that is not so would not last. There is no poor man's party.

    The politicians bullshit the public to get votes, and then they do what their campaign contributors want. Politicians live by votes, and without campaign contributions they do not win elections.

    166   coretexity   2008 Oct 5, 3:58pm  

    mike_orange: I agree with Zephyr too - we need to have the citizens wake up and consider careers in technology. It is a chicken and egg situation - why would anyone spend 40k a year college only to compete with a 70k/year H1/L1 who got his degree from god knows what college in India for 2k.

    At the same time, I hardly come across US citizens for the technology openings we have at my company. To me it looks like they've completely given up on IT/Technology and moved on to other careers like Sales/Marketing, etc. which is a pretty unfortunate indication.

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