patrick.net

I prefer that criminals are stupid. It makes them less dangerous and easier to catch.

How stupid do you have to be to steal what is essentially a tracking device with the ability to relay both video and GPS coordinates in real time? Stealing tablets and smart phones makes no sense whatsoever.

Dan8267 says

How stupid do you have to be to steal what is essentially a tracking device with the ability to relay both video and GPS coordinates in real time? Stealing tablets and smart phones makes no sense whatsoever.

That's why it almost never happens:

http://www.infoworld.com/welcome-san-francisco-heres-where-the-cellphone-thefts-are-218379

Straw Man says

http://www.infoworld.com/welcome-san-francisco-heres-where-the-cellphone-thefts-are-218379

Sometimes, I honestly don't understand you humans.

I bet more than half of those, was just morons leaving their phone behind, not remembering where, and since it wasn't at the first place they thought it would be. They just filed a report as stolen.

My daughters either lose, break or water damage their phone with in 3 weeks of buying them a new one. (Now they are on bobo phones).

One day we found about three stuffed inside the sofa.

CaptainShuddup says

I bet more than half of those, was just morons leaving their phone behind, not remembering where, and since it wasn't at the first place they thought it would be. They just filed a report as stolen.

Makes no sense: why would anyone go through the motions of driving down to the police station and filing false robbery report if his phone was simply lost or water-damaged? If you have insurance - it will pay no matter what caused the loss. No need to get creative.

What insurance? Phones cost less than a bag of groceries.
People will insure anything, all they need is Ned the head to sell it to them.

Dan8267 says

How stupid do you have to be to steal what is essentially a tracking device with the ability to relay both video and GPS coordinates in real time? Stealing tablets and smart phones makes no sense whatsoever.

Straw Man says

http://www.infoworld.com/welcome-san-francisco-heres-where-the-cellphone-thefts-are-218379

Sometimes, I honestly don't understand you humans.

Dan, policy requires analyzing the risk of unintended consequences and externalities. You're very smart but your opinions on policy seem sometimes to overlook those two points. Because cellular phones are sold primarily to carriers, who use them as bait to sell overpriced subscriptions, theft is part of the business model. The customer remains locked into the contract whatever happens to the phone, and the carrier can make extra money selling insurance. When the iPhone was available only on AT&T, customers noticed that when their phone got stolen, neither AAPL nor T would help them, in fact they had to buy a new iPhone and their old iPhone would then be sold "hot" to a new subscriber for AT&T. It's win-win-lose, i.e. AAPL and T win, you lose.

T-Mobile has improved recently, separating the phone from the service and adding a "Jump" offer to upgrade twice annually. If a phone gets lost or stolen, the customer can "Jump" to a new one, or stop the service.

Personally, I prefer the simpler method of paying for a device up front and paying for service separately, so I buy a phone and use telna mobile. That isn't as profitable for advertisers though, so the ad-driven media cover breathlessly the latest gizmo tied to a particular carrier. They make more money that way - not from me, but from the humans.

curious2 says

Because cellular phones are sold primarily to carriers

I agree with everything your saying, but I don't see how that relates to whether or not it's stupid to steal a smart phone that is basically a tracking device and has a unique ID, so you couldn't even use it as a phone and the police can track where you are. I still don't see the logic in that unless the thieves are disassembling the phones and selling the parts for repairs like they do cars, but if a phone breaks, people just replace it, not repair it.

Maybe he wanted to trade it for a belt?

Dan8267 says

I don't see how that relates to whether or not it's stupid to steal a smart phone that is basically a tracking device and has a unique ID, so you couldn't even use it as a phone and the police can track where you are.

If you look only at the technology, then the police could track the phone and probably even monitor the audio and video to identify the thief. If you look at what has been happening, the carriers have refused to cooperate, and local police have been reduced to writing up a report. There have been proposals to require the carriers to cooperate, and there have been some successes where tracking enabled tech-savvy victims to prove to police that the phone was still in their jurisdiction. I hope the situation will improve, but that takes motivation. Technically it is possible to effect the kind of system you have described, and I think that would be much better because these robberies are extremely dangerous and sometimes lethal, so I hope it will happen. But remember, the entrenched players are politically very powerful, and they've made a lot of money off the current system, and they wouldn't make more by reducing theft.

"The nation's major wireless providers have agreed to a deal with the U.S. government to build a central database of stolen cellphones—part of a broad effort to tame an explosion of thefts nationwide."

OK, but how does the thief profit from the theft of a smart phone. He can't sign up for service using it unless the service providers are in cahoots. And trying to do so is paramount to admitting you robbed a person.

A smart phone without service is more or less a pretty brick.

Dan8267 says

He can't sign up for service using it unless the service providers are in cahoots.

They have been looking the other way because that was easy and lucrative for them. Saying yes is easy and it makes money, saying no and tracking down thieves are difficult and interfere with sales. Besides, thieves can sell phones to other markets, even other countries.

Dan8267 says

And trying to do so is paramount to admitting you robbed a person.

No - you may have bought a stolen phone without realizing it had been stolen.

Dan8267 says

A smart phone without service is more or less a pretty brick.

No - they can still be used on WiFi networks. Even the proposed registry does not address that problem.

The thing is, if the NSA wanted to find your stolen phone, they could. You're paying for that technology, but you're not allowed to get the benefit of it.

When USPS wanted a rate increase, I thought they should be required to offer free tracking to go with that, instead of raising prices without improving service. Silly me. They were already tracking everything for the NSA, but the sender and recipient aren't allowed to see the information unless they pay extra for the service that they already paid for the first time.

So, in effect, the thefts happen because legislators and law enforcement don't give a shit about stopping the thefts when they could easily catch the thieves. Agreed, it's a human problem, not a technology one.

Maybe it's because I've worked with computer security people, but I still think its crazy to attach a device you stole to a network when that device can easily dial home and report it's GPS coordinates and stream video from its camera. If you don't own the device, you have no idea what software or rootkits are on it. Of course, the type of people who would steal a smart phone probably don't realize this.

I mean, you don't want to end up like this guy. No phone is worth that. An imagine if your victim is a gun nut vigilante. Things could get a lot worse.

Here's the full video...
http://www.youtube.com/embed/4uK7EG23G0w