patrick.net

bmwman91 says

It always sounds like you are trying to argue that wealthy foreigners/immigrants are the ones bring loads of cash over here.

I haven't ever wrote that argument, though some of that does go on, wealthy parents of families from places like Hong Kong, Singapore, Taipei, setting their kids up here. I know such people, you may too.

But there is also in much larger numbers a rise of new wealthy classes of folks in India and China, whose kids go to the elite schools in those places and the elite grad schools here. Many of them wind up here in the Bay Area with the big tech salaries that wind up bidding up the prices in The Fortress places.

This is different from thomas.wong's early 1990's when it was just a handful of rich fleeing Hong Kong or whatever.

B.A.C.A.H. says

And since they are elites with elite education, with their h-1's or green cards or whatever, they have access to jobs here than can pay for bidding up the prices in The Fortress.

Again you are contradicting yourself. Elites coming from China,so they must be bringing money from China,correct? Do you know that there is a cap on H-1 visas? Seriously,a guy with an H-1 can buy that Cupertino property? good luck on having people believe your elites from China theory.

bubblesitter says

Elites coming from China,so they must be bringing money from China,correct

I didn't say that. You did. I never said they brought the money bags with them. You said it.

Elite schools back home, elite grad schools here, gravitate to the Left Coast here with its H-1 jobs with the tech salaries, you know the drill. The pay can be quite good. Good enough to pay/rent/borrow for The Fortress.

I dunno why you are so hostile to these folks.

One time a Mandarin coworker such lady took me aside and discreetly explained it to me that our other immigrant coworker, a rare one who would bash Fortress Prices, did so because he was jealous.

Here's my observation about these things in bullet points.

* Post grad -level educated professionals, particularly Asians, who makes over 150K do not consider an API of under 900 as acceptable. It’s either private schools or the very best public schools, exceptions are very limited. Once you realize that, you will know that a family would rather bid on 1M Cupertino home than to live in Vallejo for free.

*Places like Palo Alto, Cupertino are among the most educated for a large town in America, Successful people generally make better decisions, don’t you think?

* A home is a pass-thru cost. The only permanent cost is the incremental property tax and interest cost associated with the mortgage, if any. Which is not that much considering the incremental earning power. All other living cost is about the same, notwithstanding the luxories.

* There is no sticker shock for most foreignors buying in the bay area.

* Facebook is just a symbol of the larger private local industry which are equity base, the most lucrative in this world by far. If Facebook employees are making it, to a smaller extent, so will Visa, Franklin Templeton, and 200+ other public companies in the immediate area. A lot of people have a lot more cash/paper wealth vs. October, not just Facebook employees.

* It doesn’t take a million dollar in cash to buy, just 250K and a good job, there are plenty where those come from. Essentially every Facebook employee can buy if they choose to. Stock option is not a one hit deal, it is a pipeline of exercise and grants. Facebook may also track companies like Saleforce, which would become 1K to 10K employee enterprise in 5 years. More stocks will be granted.

* Affording a home is a function of wealth + income. Once the wealth are made, they generally don’t disappear. The inventory of millionaires will be way up in 10 years while the inventory of SFH homes in the places that people want will not.

* People Like Edvard see’s very little step-down moving from say BA to North Carolina. For the Asians, Indians, etc. it is a huge step-down, and most likely a deal breaker no matter the cost. The demoprahic trend hasn't changed, domestic migration and interational immigration.

* Well off Parents tend to help their adult children buy homes. A Facebook employee who already owns in Cupertino will likely pass along enough money to their kids to buy their homes nearby, most likely in the vicinity. Asian parents tend to pass along some of their wealth to their kids earlier. That is why open houses are full of traffic and decent homes in good locations don't last a week.

* Outside money is significant. Most foreign students who attended a university here/Canada are generally wealthy or moderately wealthy and most can place a phone call to mom and dad at home to wire 200K-300K easily. Some comes as young as 10-12 years old, send their kids, with mom to the US for school while the breadwinner (usually in business stays in China) About 50% stays and 50% goes back. Most end up having dual homes. There are significant more Asian foreigners applying and being accepted to US and Canada universities.

*Even the poorer/older immigrants have way more money now than they use to. China is basically 80% public housing in the past and they have buy-out a lot of the residence in exchange for lump sum payments. They come in here looking poor but have a six figure USD bank account. To top it off, they get retirement $$ in china as well as use the benefits here.

SFace says

The inventory of millionaires will be way up in 10 years while the inventory of SFH homes in the places that people want will not.

That will surprise me considering what I've read about U.S. household savings rates. I would guess there will be more millionaires, but not that the statistic would "be way up." Didn't a lot of people just take themselves out of the running who might have qualified?

http://www.frbsf.org/publications/economics/letter/2009/el2009-16.html#3

SFace says

Post grad -level educated professionals, particularly Asians, who makes over 150K do not consider an API of under 900 as acceptable. It’s either private schools or the very best public schools, exceptions are very limited. Once you realize that, you will know that a family would rather bid on 1M Cupertino home than to live in Vallejo for fre

This is a little ridiculous though... I went to a low 800 API high school and never scratched the surface of what the school actually had to offer academically.

Asian buyers should realize their student would have a lot easier time being VALEDICTORIAN of a high 700 or low 800 API school. And realize that will look a hell of a lot better to colleges to be top of their class, instead of lost in the middle of the pack at some over 900 api school that no one outside of the area cares about.

Sometimes it's better to be a big fish in a little pond.

SFace says

Post grad -level educated professionals, particularly Asians,

SFace says

Successful people generally make better decisions

SFace says

There is no sticker shock for most foreignors

SFace says

It doesn’t take a million dollar home to buy, just 250K and a good job,

SFace says

People Like Edvard see’s very little step-down moving from say BA to North Carolina. For the Asians, Indians, etc. it is a huge step-down

SFace says

Outside money is significant. Most foreign students who attended a university here/Canada are generally wealthy or moderately wealthy and most can place a phone call to mom and dad at home to wire 200K-300K easily

bubblesitter, see ?

EDIT:
Was a long post. I think it was mostly rambling, so I cleared it.

bmwman91 says

They buy in Cupertino & Saratoga for the schools, and constantly bitch about the stress of barely making house payments. Lots of them also have hefty car payments too.

You summed up Indians and asians very well.

These bastard monkeys think that "top schools" is going to automatically make their children successful.

Most of them force their children to go into medical, law and engineering thinking that's they only way to make huge shit loads of money. Anything else is to them guaranteed poverty.

Those careers except engineering are no longer easy to make money in. Even engineering is becoming a bit more hard.

They are the biggest pussies I've ever known in my life. They only pick these careers because they are fearful and need some type of career which is rigged in it's salary. Medical is one career which is rigged by the American Medical Association to keep salaries artificially high.

But the salaries of doctors is beginning to collapse slowly.

They earn 300K a year working 60-80 hours and then blow it on some overpriced million dollar cardboard dump.

Buy a bmw/benz/lexus usually on a loan or on lease. And the rest of their money they spend on clothes to keep up appearances along with spoiling the shit of their little brats.

Indians/asians are the most cheapest and greediest people but they are defiantly NOT good with money, investment or saving. Their delusion to me is astounding.

They feel a 300K salary makes them super-wealthy....

That's actually no where near wealthy anymore. Decent and comfortable lifestyle? Defiantly. But rich? Fuck no.

2/3rds of doctors and lawyers end up broke at the end of their life. Remember that.

When you give fearful brain-dead peasants a little bit of money, they end up thinking they are more than what they really are.

The medical insurance scam along with the pharmaceutical cartel plus AMA limiting the number of doctors admitted into practice to purposely rig the salaries to keep them higher along with denying medical school admission for no fucking reason to well-qualified candidates other than limiting the number of doctors to perpetuate their propaganda of a "shortage of medical professionals".

The medical insurance system also drives up medical costs and thus salaries. It is an unsustainable ponzi scheme which will collapse and the yearly debt from this insurance system is paid by the tax payers.

Sorry to get off topic...

But the majority of these FOB indians and asians are involved in this profession.

And by the way...

Never ever deal with a Indian or asian when buying or selling real estate. They are the worst people to deal with. Very unreasonable and demanding more than what they deserve.

I predict that Asians and indians will be the poorest people when a crash in the whole economic system comes in America.

Cupertino will one day become like Detroit.

As what happened to the auto industry in Detroit will happen to the computer/technology/internet industry in Cupertino.

Only 100X worse. At least the auto industry actually produced something of real tangible value.

lol I love a good tirade.

I am not really certain that your berating of Asians & Indians is entirely accurate. I would extend it to PEOPLE in general. Whites, blacks & Mexicans want to do the exact same thing, but are apparently too lazy to put the work in to pull the salaries necessary to live the "$300k/year, live paycheck-to-paycheck" lifestyle. White folks (my people) crack me up the most. They tell their kids to pursue "whatever makes them happy" and then let them borrow $50k+ to study 17th century literature or something. Yeah...pursuing your passion is great & all, but you kind of need some common sense, and a lot more hard work if you want to do more than live at a subsistence level. At least the Asians & Indians force their kids to put some effort into it.

bmwman91 says

White folks (my people) crack me up the most. They tell their kids to pursue "whatever makes them happy" and then let them borrow $50k+ to study 17th century literature or something. Yeah...pursuing your passion is great & all, but you kind of need some common sense, and a lot more hard work if you want to do more than live at a subsistence level. At least the Asians & Indians force their kids to put some effort into it.

Tell me about it. I can't even count the number of people I know borrowing >$50k to get degrees in "communications" and archaeology. Yeah...good luck with that.

bmwman91 says

They buy in Cupertino & Saratoga for the schools, and constantly bitch about the stress of barely making house payments. Lots of them also have hefty car payments too.

You wont be hearing that from the predecessors (former homeowners). LOL! god forbid you even mention how much cheaper homes were before. Cupertino or Saratoga.

Robber Baron Elite Scum says

Cupertino will one day become like Detroit.
As what happened to the auto industry in Detroit will happen to the computer/technology/internet industry in Cupertino.

In the auto industry, you can always put more options into next years model plus inflation will increase the price of the autos sold in the future.

Its the opposite in tech land.. todays product does 10x more and will cost 1/10 then similar product 5 years ago.

Robber Baron Elite Scum says

Never ever deal with a Indian or asian when buying or selling real estate

Egos !

bmwman91 says

you kind of need some common sense, and a lot more hard work if you want to do more than live at a subsistence level. At least the Asians & Indians force their kids to put some effort into it.

I only partially agree with you and I only partially disagree with you.

Spending 50K a year to study literature is defiantly DUMB.

But neither is it einstein smart to go into a career you hate, have no REAL interest in, desperate for money and are just doing it to make your parents happy.

Trust me... The majority of these fucking chinks and hindu monkeys are ONLY going into medical for the MONEY... They don't give a fuck about helping sick people, healing the diseases or saving lives...

They DO NOT GIVE A DAMN FUCK ABOUT THAT.....

These clowns think they will make millions of dollars no joke! I know one that thinks $1,000,000 is going to be possible as a general doctor owning his own private practice.

What a dumb brainwashed idiot... Private practices ESPECIALLY general family private practices are being bankrupted by insurances companies, lobbyists and government policies. By the time, he graduates and has done residency... The game for private practice will be long gone OVER. And he'll have to take a much lower salary than he anticipated working for a hospital or a big medical center company.

Doctors are now being employed NOT self-employed like before.

The big money in being a doctor is no longer going into their pockets anymore. Gradually all the big money is going to the insurance companies, big hospitals, big medical centers, pharmaceutical companies and the government.

Not to mention the massive turd of fucking debt just to go to fucking medical school. You first have to take 4 years of useless college. ONLY than can you apply for admission to medical school.

If they don't take you.. which they don't for the majority of candidates who are more than well-qualified... YOU ARE FUCKED!

The majority of people trying to be a doctor never become one. And a very high percentage of doctors hate their job.

Why? Because they just want money. That's it. They don't give a flying fuck about helping anyone.

It's all about materialism. Make mom and dad think you are better than everyone else because you make a certain amount of money. Their parent's than go to family friend group parties to brag about it. That's all it is.

Trust me, I know their culture very well.

Now, I don't think their is anything wrong with that. The problem is that they are not fucking honest about it. But also is the problem that they are chasing after peanuts while being so fucking proud that they spend all of it like money is going out of style.

$300K is nothing when you factor in how expensive everything has become. It really is not the same money it was before. Nowhere near rich or wealthy EVEN as a single person with minimal expenses. Just being well-off and doing good doesn't make a person Rockefeller rich.

Also remember that $300K is not a likely salary for a new general doctor. More like $175K MAXIMUM. Realistically $150K.

Then you must factor in student loan debt PLUS insurance PLUS taxes PLUS living expenses. Most of them have a very expensive lifestyle.

And their kids aren't really putting effort into anything. Medical school doesn't teach you jack shit. Many doctors are the biggest fucking idiots who are nothing but dangerous to your body and health.

And working on the job, do they put in any effort? Fuck no! They just write scripts to toxic drugs so you die faster while pocketing kickbacks from the pharmaceutical companies to prescribe their trash. Big conflict of interest!

The most time a doctor spends with you is a short quick few minutes. The nurses and the physician's assistants' do the majority of the work and tend to be in many cases smarter than these fucking smart aleck posers.

Yuppies like these immigrants will be slaughtered in the coming crash. They are the most blind idiots to not see what's going to come and how absolutely catastrophic the condition of the economy is really in.

Going to medical school and law school to expect yourself to make millions automatically is a disaster recipe.

And trust me. A lot of people are doing just that. They will be severely disappointed.

bmwman91 says

but are apparently too lazy to put the work in to pull the salaries necessary to live the "$300k/year, live paycheck-to-paycheck" lifestyle.

Chinks and hindu monkeys are also lazy. They don't do shit besides using loopholes, artificial market salaries and short-term gimmicks to earn the "$300K/year" lifestyle.

And than they blow that money as much as they can. That's what all Yuppies do. Doesn't matter if they are white, asian, black or indian.

I understand mexicans, whites and blacks also have this problem...

But to be completely honest... This problem is many many times greater in indians and asians. Their level of entitlement, pride, materialism and ego-trips are completely over the top.

It's so easy for me to tell these kids don't really have much of a passion about medical school. They just want money...

And I don't think there is anything wrong with that. The problem is that they are so fucking dishonest about it and way too much of a fucking PUSSY to start a business if money is what they really want.

Also a bank will give anyone with a valid medical degree and a valid license to practice medicine a mortgage/loan as long as they have a down payment and ok credit.

And the mortgage/loan they will approve them for will be VERY recklessly high.

They are given mortgages by banks they have NO FUCKING BUSINESS taking. And they only get that mortgage approved because their occupation happens to be doctor or something considered "safe".

Otherwise a similar applicant with the same income and same credit except different occupation would NOT get approved for that same mortgage limit.

Due to these reasons as well. The majority of doctors live very high on credit cards, car payment, mortgage payments and a expensive lifestyle.

They are yuppies... Spend till you are broke.

thomas.wong1986 says

In the auto industry, you can always put more options into next years model plus inflation will increase the price of the autos sold in the future.

Its the opposite in tech land.. todays product does 10x more and will cost 1/10 then similar product 5 years ago.

+1

Exactly!

thomas.wong1986 says

Egos !

+1

And trust me, I've seen a lot of them with egos!

They are the most smug group of people. I really hate to sound racist but I have NEVER met truly humble indians and asians.

They always love to brag about their worthless educational degrees and think they are so fucking smart than everyone.

They are the most annoying people to be around. And if they are find out you are 100X wealthier than them but you don't have any special university degrees...

They become EXTREMELY jealous and envious. They actually begin to hate you. No joke.

They also begin to put in smart ass comments like "If your business fails, than what will you do."

Well you dumbfuck... That's what FUCKING SAVINGS ARE FOR... Which you idiots never do.

Robber baron elite scum,

Your posts are full of anger towarda Asian..... I will just make a couple points given i am an Asian but still homeless. It is true that Asians always put more hopes or rather impose their own aspirations kids. Being a doctor, lawyer etc are always viewed favorably. But, back in Asia, to get into the professions, you have to be the best of the best, so it filters out many money-driven yet not *smart* enough people ... But when the same expectations on kids cross the pacific to American system, it becomes somewhat distorted. Do you want to blame the parents or the American system that will accept anyone who can *afford* as long as there are reasonable grade? And, what ups with the 300k? It is middle class life style If you have a house by bay area standard. Most of my Asian friends don't spend much money besides house. ..... I don't know what kind of Asians do you know ..... Maybe, your kind of profession or neighborhood is surrounded by different kinds of people.

SparrowBell says

Most of my Asian friends don't spend much money besides house. ..... I don't know what kind of Asians do you know ..... Maybe, your kind of profession or neighborhood is surrounded by different kinds of people.

Perhaps...

I've defiantly seen the crazy spending though. $150,000 one night parties.

Indians doctor being arrested for $2,000,000 insurance fraud. Another one did $10,000,000 million dollar fraud.

I knew these people by association.

SparrowBell says

the American system that will accept anyone who can *afford* as long as there are reasonable grade?

This is grossly false. They are many well-qualified candidates with high GPA that are never accepted into medical school when they fucking deserve it.

SparrowBell says

But, back in Asia,

They don't make excessive amounts of money for the service they provide. So comparing Asia to here is not relevant to this discussion neither applicable.

SparrowBell says

Your posts are full of anger towarda Asian

No. I disagree. I'm just giving them what they deserve.

B.A.C.A.H. says

bubblesitter, see ?

Correct, pretty soon whites will be in minority in BA. Overextending Chinese will drive them out of BA. :)

noooooooo not another Race War...aaaarrrggghhh...;)

wthrfrk80 says

noooooooo not another Race War...aaaarrrggghhh...;)

Sorry,I did not start it. I had too much of this Chinese and BA thing.

Robber Baron Elite Scum says

But neither is it einstein smart to go into a career you hate, have no REAL interest in, desperate for money and are just doing it to make your parents happy.

Absolutely. In the end, the whole point of ANY of what we do is to find happiness. Having kids and raising them well...the point is to make them successful because you would be UNhappy if they weren't! Working a job that you may or may not care about...the point is to get some money so that you can live where you want, eat what you want and have hobbies/travel/whatever.

So many people, of all classes and races, have totally lost sight of this. They are totally fixated on the "make money" part, since it IS a part of the happiness equation, but forget that it is only one part of it. The point is to live your life, since you only have one. So many people completely forget to live while they are engrossed with getting money since they "need it to live how they want." Well, what good is all that money if you piss away 20-40 years of your life chasing it...you are going to be too old and too out of shape to do a lot of the stuff that you dreamed about when you were in your 30's & 40's!

It's about finding a balance. It's about thinking for yourself and not blindly accepting society's dogmas (aspire to home ownership, money = success, what strangers think of you is important). It's about living your own life, for yourself. Living life has become synonymous with "making money" which is just sad. Yeah, you do need it in this society, but you are a fool if you let anyone but yourself decide how much you actually need to get what you want. It is also foolish, and in fact very dangerous, to let anyone else tell what you want.

bmwman91 says

So many people, of all classes and races, have totally lost sight of this. They are totally fixated on the "make money" part, since it IS a part of the happiness equation, but forget that it is only one part of it. The point is to live your life, since you only have one. So many people completely forget to live while they are engrossed with getting money since they "need it to live how they want." Well, what good is all that money if you piss away 20-40 years of your life chasing it...you are going to be too old and too out of shape to do a lot of the stuff that you dreamed about when you were in your 30's & 40's!

Very true, sadly. It's even more true in an area where shacks sell for half a million bucks. Is nice weather really THAT important? Central heating/air conditioning were invented for a reason.

wthrfrk80 says

Very true, sadly. It's even more true in an area where shacks sell for half a million bucks. Is nice weather really THAT important? Central heating/air conditioning were invented for a reason.

Ha, "the weather" likely only affects these goobers twice a day: when they walk from the car to the office, and when they walk from the office to the car. The rest of the time they are glued to a LCD screen or TV. It really chaps my ass that people love it here for "the weather" and barely spend any time outside. Given how much time I spend enjoying the outdoors, these sissies really need to go seek their fortunes somewhere else since "the weather" has negligible effects on them anyway.

bmwman91 says

Ha, "the weather" likely only affects these goobers twice a day: when they walk from the car to the office, and when they walk from the office to the car. The rest of the time they are glued to a LCD screen or TV. It really chaps my ass that people love it here for "the weather" and barely spend any time outside. Given how much time I spend enjoying the outdoors, these sissies really need to go seek their fortunes somewhere else since "the weather" has negligible effects on them anyway.

That's hilarious.

Yeah last time I checked a cubicle in San Jose looks the same as a cubicle in Cleveland.

And they probably all fight to get parking spots as close to the front entrance as possible.

wthrfrk80 says

And they probably all fight to get parking spots as close to the front entrance as possible.

No we don't. We share those spots! We wait in our idling cars for another to open up.

wthrfrk80 says

And they probably all fight to get parking spots as close to the front entrance as possible.

That shit drives me insane. Yeah buddy, sit there waiting for 5 minutes for someone to leave a close spot, and block up the parking lot. Nevermind that I parked 50 feet further away and am walking past you while you are still waiting. I'd say that I don't understand how those people think, but I know that this sort of idiocy comes from NOT thinking in the first place.

wthrfrk80 says

bmwman91 says

Ha, "the weather" likely only affects these goobers twice a day: when they walk from the car to the office, and when they walk from the office to the car. The rest of the time they are glued to a LCD screen or TV. It really chaps my ass that people love it here for "the weather" and barely spend any time outside. Given how much time I spend enjoying the outdoors, these sissies really need to go seek their fortunes somewhere else since "the weather" has negligible effects on them anyway.

That's hilarious.

Yeah last time I checked a cubicle in San Jose looks the same as a cubicle in Cleveland.

That sounds good, but the job in San Jose isn't the same job you can get in Cleveland. If you don't know the right people and are willing to work for basically nothing (and still have no job security), you can't really get any professional job in Cleveland that isn't tied to caring for the elderly or managing their money. I spent thirty years up there. I've seen it.

bmwman91 says

That shit drives me insane. Yeah buddy, sit there waiting for 5 minutes for someone to leave a close spot, and block up the parking lot. Nevermind that I parked 50 feet further away and am walking past you while you are still waiting. I'd say that I don't understand how those people think, but I know that this sort of idiocy comes from NOT thinking in the first place.

So much for being eco-conscious, haha.

rootvg says

That sounds good, but the job in San Jose isn't the same job you can get in Cleveland. If you don't know the right people and are willing to work for basically nothing (and still have no job security), you can't really get any professional job in Cleveland that isn't tied to caring for the elderly or managing their money. I spent thirty years up there. I've seen it.

Very true, yes. I'm originally from Erie, PA and I know the situation well. I've often joked that if it weren't for old folks having heart attacks, we wouldn't have an economy here in the Rust Belt at all. ;)

rootvg says

you can't really get any professional job in Cleveland that isn't tied to caring for the elderly or managing their money

But the houses are cheap! Get 'em before they're bulldozed!

CL says

Get 'em before they're bulldozed!

You're thinking of Detroit. I'm not aware of Cleveland doing this...yet.

wthrfrk80 says

CL says

Get 'em before they're bulldozed!

You're thinking of Detroit. I'm not aware of Cleveland doing this...yet.

Cleveland hasn't done it yet but it's coming. The loss of population is at such a level that it will have to.

rootvg says

Cleveland hasn't done it yet but it's coming. The loss of population is at such a level that it will have to.

Yep. I forget...was Cleveland the "mistake by the lake" of legend?

bmwman91 says

It's about finding a balance. It's about thinking for yourself and not blindly accepting society's dogmas (aspire to home ownership, money = success, what strangers think of you is important). It's about living your own life, for yourself.

Preach it, bmwman! You really went on a roll back there. I agree with where you went, but have added to my own thoughts that happiness is fleeting for humans. What works best for me is staying connected to what's alive in my thoughts. What's exciting and fun? For me, it's been music for a long time. So while I've managed to make money doing something pretty fun too, I've also managed a twenty year career as a musician. I think many people find these things, but many don't.

CL says

Yep. I forget...was Cleveland the "mistake by the lake" of legend?

Ha ha. That's what my friends from Pittsburgh call it! Despite the rivalry between the two cities, they're in the same boat. Although the industrial collapse happened in Pittsburgh back in the early 80's and the metro area's economy is fairly stable now.